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  • judge bf and critique

    Hey guys, just curious as to what you think my bodyfat is based on these pics?
    Keep in mind that I'm quite depleted in these pics, as I've ate 50 g carbs for the last 6 days and have already done a few depletion workouts. I usually look much more full.

    Anyways, some stats: I'm 5'10, 182 lbs, at whatever bf you see. Max lifts: bench-325, squat-420, DL- 485.

    I started my diet 7 weeks ago, at 20% bf and have since dieted down to what you see. I've kind of been running my own experiment to see how hard I can train on low calories, while maintaining my strength and burning bodyfat as quick as possible. This has just been an experiment and far from the type of training Lyle recommends on such low PSMF type calories. Believe me, I know most of this looks dumb, but it's really just been an experiment. Also, I love to train, and am also just trying to burn a ton of calories though training and avoid cardio.

    I would not have continued to do any of this if my performance declined. Believe it or not, I've actually gained strength and seemed to develop a more rounded look to my muscles.

    I've basically been training super high volume, old school BB type. I started off with ABC workouts, repeat, then sunday off. A- chest//shoulder/tris, B-back/bis, C-legs. Walking was done for 20 mins after each wo.

    Lately, I've pushed the volume even farther and have done an ABABAB-off split the last two weeks, which entails an insane amount of volume and takes about 2 hours or more each time. One A wo(A1) consists of one compound exercise of 3X3-5, then about 5 more exercises of 6-10 for just, let's say chest alone. For smaller muscle groups it'd be more like 3-4 exercises. The next A wo for chest, for example, I do two exercises in the 8-12 rep range, two in the 12-15 rep range, and two in the 15-20 rep range.

    My diet has been basically at PSMF calorie levels: 190 g protein, 50 g carb, and 25 g fat daily(10 g fish oil). I started off having one large carb meal every 4th nite and now I've been skiploading every 7th nite for about 10 hours. I basically take in about 10,000 calories during this time, 2,000 grams worth of carbs. The next day I always look more full and get a great pump in the gym. In addition, my mood is good again, and my libido is quite strong. I believe it has to do with the hormonal effects of the refeed: test raise(SHBG), elevated IGF-1, leptin, tyroid, etc. Again, just another experiment I'm doing based on something I read that states it take 55 cals per pound bodyweight to restore leptin. Eitherway, I enjoy the binge fest and I've continued to get leaner.

    Anyways, I was just wondering your opinion on my BF percentage? Also, what do you recommend I do from now. If I look like crap, I'll gladely change goals: too skinny, cortisol bomb. My current goal is to reach 5% bf, but I'd like to do it a different way, as this much training is just to time consuming and kind of stupid too, other than just burning tons of calories. Any other critique is welcome if you would. Keep in mind I'm very depleted in these pics. Do I look like I don't have the LBM to look good at 5%?
    Attached Files
    "Where the mind goes the body follows." -Arnold

  • #2
    15-20 but it's hard with those crappy pics. And no leg shots.
    2014 USPA Nevada State / Regional Championships - 1,168 total

    2014 USPA National Championships - 1,235 total

    2014 Village Gym Meet - 1,260 total

    2015 USPA Camp Pendleton Meet - 1,235 total



    • #3
      Here's some more after eating some carbs last nite. I filled out a little more and it always seems to take away my bloat. Got a back pic and some leg shots. Based on these pics what bf would you say I am? Also, do you think it'd be good to stick with my current goal of 5% bf with my current LBM or change to something else? Any other critique?

      Attached Files
      "Where the mind goes the body follows." -Arnold


      • #4
        one more
        Attached Files
        "Where the mind goes the body follows." -Arnold


        • #5
          I'd say about 17% or maybe 15% + water. When you flex the midsection you can kind of make out some ab outlines, it looks like.
          I know for myself, I can be 8% but with enough water and salt in me I easily look like I'm 11 or 12% haha.

          By the way, you have a very good back.


          • #6
            I think the others are pretty close on the bf guess. I wouldn't get too caught up in the numbers. You said you would change goals but that is something you need to decide and let the others help you towards that goal. If you want to be 5% then make it happen! Just know for most 5% requires some suffering and is hard to maintain for any amount of time.

            Couple things jump out at me. From the macros you listed your at about 1200 cals a day and doing 2 hours of training 6 days a week. What is your plan for when progress stalls? How long does it take you to baseline after the skipload? I don't know what you were doing before but seems like you went all in from the start. You stated that you can't maintain that level of training and you have no room to drop cals.

            You have strong lifts so your doing something right. I normally don't give advice because there are much more experienced people here that normally have better advice but i'll give you my .02. Take a couple weeks and drop back to a level of training you can maintain. Increase your cals and try to find your maint. level. From there you can add a little cardio or drop the cals a little until progress stalls then make another small change. Its much easier to make slow steady progress this way. I am going to start dieting using same approach in Jan. I will drop 300 cals/day and add 20 mins cardio 3x a week. When that stops working i'll add more cardio or drop a lil more cals. i hit single digit bf levels pretty easily this way over the summer.
            6/22/13 - 2013 NPC VICTORY CLASSIC
            1st - Novice Men's Lightheavy & Novice overall


            • #7
              Thanks for the responses.

              Yeah, you're right LKQSJH. I know I can't maintain this type of training and Diet, since I don't have any room for many adjustments towards my goal. I've actually been at this for a while , about 7 weeks. With the type of training I'm doing and my huge deficit I'd think I'd have lost way more fat: I started at 20%. A Lot of my high volume training has been more of an addiction I always feel like crappie on days I don't, so I figured I 'd try an old school high volume style workout.

              I think it's pretty cool though that I've managed to gain strength while training so much and eating so little.
              My deficit must be 2,500 some days. I read some of Lyle McDonald's and that's what puts a lot of ideas in my head. Weird thing is, I did carb cycling and BFL before for 8 weeks, was fatter when I started, and ended up leaner by this point. Despite less training and less deficit.

              Anyways, I'm going to stick to my 5% goal and know I'll achieve it. It's been like an itch I've needed to scratch since I was 20. I will do what you recommend though and take 2 weeks off, start up with less, and leave room for adjustments. Might start with Lane Norton's pat routine.

              I really want to compete too. I love BBing and I've been working at developing a physique worthy of the stage. Do any of you think I have a physique that could be worthy of competing? I do have a little scoliosis, hopefully it wouldn't be a setback.

              Oh, thanks for the comment wanna be pro. My back has always been my strong point. I always use the whole stack on lat pull downs for my sets.
              "Where the mind goes the body follows." -Arnold


              • #8
                I'm sure you do feel crappie on those cals lol. I am a former fattie so i know all about going extreme and losing 10-15lbs only to rebound and be fatter than i started.

                I try to keep it simple. You seem to be a thinker from your post and read stuff from smart people but at the end of the day getting lean isn't all that complicated. Pick a smart approach and stick with it. Skiploading worked amazing for me and all the info you need is right here. I never had the spare funds to hire skip but if you do it will help you reach your goals that much faster.

                For training i will quote homon -
                "If you want to maintain the muscle you build with living heavy with an abbreviated volume approach, then lifting heavy is the best way to do that. Shortened rest intervals will mean lighter loads.

                IMO, the point of the weight training workouts is not to expend energy to create a caloric deficit for fat loss. It's to maintain the hypertrophic stimulus to keep the muscle mass you've gained. Diet and cardio are the means of the fat loss."

                From this thread -

                If you hit 5% now you will be roughly 160ish at 5'10. I think you will look more like mp than bb at that height and weight but you never know until you get lean. If you get there and aren't happy you will be primed to grow at that point and can make some great gains so its a win either way. Anyone can compete at the smaller local level shows so just pick a show and commit. If you get lean you will hang in the novice class no problem and no matter how you place you can learn and grow from there.
                6/22/13 - 2013 NPC VICTORY CLASSIC
                1st - Novice Men's Lightheavy & Novice overall


                • #9
                  Thanks for all the great advice. I do tend to over complicate things, as I read so much information all the time, get new ideas, etc, from Alan Aragon, Lyle, Layne, Keifer, skip. I'm going to try and just focus on following my training routine, hitting my macros, and taking my supps. I believe that's basicially all that counts. I tend to be obsesive and I can never seem to stop thinking about my diet, training, I mean, it's like all day.

                  By the way, I hear you on the fat part lol. I went trough the same thing: I was about 250 lbs at age 17, but 3 inches shorter than I am now. I seemed to carry it all on my gut too. Ended up basically starving myself to an anorexic looking 135lbs in about 14 months.
                  "Where the mind goes the body follows." -Arnold