Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

question about frequency

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • question about frequency

    Im am just going to say first, that if this answer is obvious than I am truly sorry and its not like I have not done enough thorough research.

    Now in terms of frequency on dc 2 way split, alot of the times m/w/f is set up, were everything is hit twice in 8 days. In dc old articles, and his cycle for pennies he recommended, and his personal split was m/t/t/f so everything hit twice in a week. My question is that I would like to give the 4 days per week a try, or at least eod training, but do you think this will be to much physically?

    Cheers

  • #2
    Unless your incredibly advanced, which is very unlikely considering the fact that you asked that question, do the two way split. Even the three way split is probably too advanced for you. (I'm not saying this to be mean, just to be as informative as possible for you.) Have you been training long enough to train DC at all?

    Get to reading the stickies in the dogg pound!
    :preach:

    Comment


    • #3
      That is why I started the question with putting it out there that I have done a ton of research high and low and still unsure on if this 4 day a week protocol, or eod on the 2 way split is still advocated by dc.

      If you read his old posts or his cycles for pennies you will see how he advocated and used the 2 way split 4 days per week. I am wondering if any one have done this 2 way 4 times per week or eod.

      and also just in case you didn't know the more advanced you are the more time off you need between workouts, not the other way around

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by tacoman View Post
        and also just in case you didn't know the more advanced you are the more time off you need between workouts, not the other way around
        So you are saying that more ADVANCED trainers should NOT be doing the 3 way split, over 4 days? Is this what I'm understanding?

        Yes, advanced guys may need more time to recover, but the 3 way us set up so your workouts are very brief since you would be capable of training so intensely......you are in the gym 4 days a week with the 3 way, but hitting each body part a couple to a few times less each month than the 2 way....

        Stick to the 2 way. That is the split that is the starting point for most guys.....
        STEEL




        "SIMPLICITY, CONSISTENCY, INTENSITY"

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by steel1970 View Post
          So you are saying that more ADVANCED trainers should NOT be doing the 3 way split, over 4 days? Is this what I'm understanding?

          Yes, advanced guys may need more time to recover, but the 3 way us set up so your workouts are very brief since you would be capable of training so intensely......you are in the gym 4 days a week with the 3 way, but hitting each body part a couple to a few times less each month than the 2 way....

          Stick to the 2 way. That is the split that is the starting point for most guys.....
          Maybe I didn't make what I was asking very clear. I do not want to do the 3 way split, I am doing the 2 way. What I was asking was how I was noticing how dc was saying in his old posts and in his cycles for pennies that he did the 2way monday/tuesday/thursday/friday vs m/w/f so just alittle more frequency.

          He has since seemed to stick to just advocating the m/w/f frequency but still if he used the 2 way 4 times per week with success, than I could see it working with someone who has good recovery abilities.

          Comment


          • #6
            These posts come up every now and then and the OP invariably gets slammed. Just try DC the regular way. If this is not enough for you/ you have almost mythical recovery abilities then give the M,T,T,F split a go.

            Just be sure to keep your log book accurate so you can truly judge if it has been to your advantage.

            I personally can only do the 2 way on M,W,F if everything is perfect. When working shift work this is way too much for me. I am 36 though. I find my deadlift wipes me out for days if I am on shift and trying to sleep during in the day.

            Can you post your lifts because I think that people who don't lift much weight yet seem to fing DC "Easy" whereas if you are doing bigger weights you really notice the Rest Pause effect.
            "Be gentle in what you do, firm in how you do it."
            Buck Brannaman.

            "It is the certainty of punishment that deters crime, not the severity of it."
            'Hanging' Judge PARKER

            "Nothing is so powerful as an insight into human nature... what compulsions drive a man, what instincts dominate his action... if you know these things about a man you can touch him at the core of his being."
            ~William Bernbach

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by tacoman View Post
              Maybe I didn't make what I was asking very clear. I do not want to do the 3 way split, I am doing the 2 way. What I was asking was how I was noticing how dc was saying in his old posts and in his cycles for pennies that he did the 2way monday/tuesday/thursday/friday vs m/w/f so just alittle more frequency.

              He has since seemed to stick to just advocating the m/w/f frequency but still if he used the 2 way 4 times per week with success, than I could see it working with someone who has good recovery abilities.
              you are quite right as the 2 way split was with 4 day frequency in cycle for pennies (cfp).. but i recall vaguely reason for it now being on a 3 day/week as...at that time (cfp) dc was limited to a few people specially if you talk about cpf - that board had members juicing and all...therefore had recovery edge..

              as dc grew more and more natural guys tried it & it evolved to a 3 day/week split which was more suited to normal/avg recovery/life kinda guys.

              make sense? if not .. go ahead try it on 4 days...it wont kill you...but if u r true to the program you will feel 3 days are optimal.

              Comment


              • #8
                In addition to knowing the weights you are training with, I would also be interested in know what types of programs you have used in the past, how you recovered from those workouts, your nutrition, how stressful is your job/life, amount of sleep and the exercises you plan on using for the 4 day per week split you are proposing.

                With DC, when you push it to your absolute limit on the two-way, it is going to make you really want to take that extra day off (so you are only doing training 3 days per week). And training 4 days per week can wear on your joints and force you to cut your balst short. What do think would be better, doing the standard 2 way and stringing out your blast to 12 weeks or continuous gains in bodyweight, muscle mass, and training weights or going 4 days per week on the two way and having to cut you balst short thus limiting your growth and increases in training weight? These are just things to consider in relation to your recovery ability.

                Another thing to keep in mind with training 3 days per week is that you can use your off days to do cardio so you are able to stay pretty lean while adding tons of muscle. I'm not saying you can't do cardio on the 4 day per week schedule, but how are your legs going to feel after doing widowmakers two days per week, week in and week out? So doing cardio in addition to the widowmakers will limit your recovery ability (I am talking about real cardio here, not 10-15 minutes of walking to get help with blood flow and oxygen).

                Not trying to sound pompous or like an ass here, but I beleive I have a pretty good recovery ability and some weeks when my schedule forced me, I had to train every other day (so 4 days per week) and have been able to do so effectively but this only lasted about two weeks in a row and I can tell you that over a prolonged period of time, it would become difficult to keep up that level of intensity or not burnout mentally and physically.

                Take some of the above points into consideration. I would still like to hear your responses to the questions I had because I am curious if you really would be able to handle a 4 day per week 2 way split and the reasoning you have for choosing to take on that challenge.

                As for the original cycles for pennies:

                http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthr...cycles+pennies

                Originally posted by Sammich View Post
                It's essentially obsolete now. Dante has refined what he first wrote and superseded it with things that work much better.
                http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthr...778#post807778

                Originally posted by ScottMcDonough View Post
                It's really outdated info at this point... what are you hoping to learn from it?
                Originally posted by Massive G View Post
                I think if I could grant one wish to someone it would probably be to Dante who has said many times he wishes that old outdated cycling for pennies disappeared from the net.
                *poof!*
                Last edited by mentalflex; 06-19-2012, 09:09 AM.
                Be true to yourself and fuel your body with nothing less the highest quality supplements. Only available at TrueNutrition.com Use discount code: KSP945 to save 5% on your order!

                Stickies...just read the damn stickies...

                2014 Xcalibur Cup Bantam Open - 1st
                2014 Tracey Greenwood Classic Bantam Open - 1st
                2015 Beat Cancer!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by greatkeen View Post
                  you are quite right as the 2 way split was with 4 day frequency in cycle for pennies (cfp).. but i recall vaguely reason for it now being on a 3 day/week as...at that time (cfp) dc was limited to a few people specially if you talk about cpf - that board had members juicing and all...therefore had recovery edge..

                  as dc grew more and more natural guys tried it & it evolved to a 3 day/week split which was more suited to normal/avg recovery/life kinda guys.

                  make sense? if not .. go ahead try it on 4 days...it wont kill you...but if u r true to the program you will feel 3 days are optimal.
                  I don't think it is wise to say that it was changed simply due to trainees' drug status. There are plenty of guys, enhanced and not enhanced, who would have trouble recovering from the 4 day a week program. It was changed because of an overall look at recovery, that's all. If it had only to do with someone's drug status, don't you think there'd be "DC for naturals" and " DC for enhanced"? You guys put WAAAAAAAY too much emphasis on drugs and it really is silly. Yes they help, but they are not the be all end all, and they certainly don't replace other key factors like, diet, rest, recovery, etc......

                  To the OP, there is absolutely NO reason for you to run the 4 day program when you've never even run the 3 day yet. Run the 2 way 3 day split for 6 weeks and run it balls to the wall, and I guarantee you won't need anymore work, especially if you are physically and mentally prepared to run DC in the first place...
                  STEEL




                  "SIMPLICITY, CONSISTENCY, INTENSITY"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The 2-way split should be done 3 days per week.
                    The 3-way split can be done over 4 days.
                    -KidRok-
                    "...because I won't accept that I can't."


                    www.https://Truenutrition.com/
                    5% OFF with Discount Code "FXL222"

                    https://www.facebook.com/hopsfitnessxl

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by KidRok View Post
                      The 2-way split should be done 3 days per week.
                      The 3-way split can be done over 4 days.
                      ^^^^^^this.....and you probably aren't advanced enough to need to do the 3 way
                      STEEL




                      "SIMPLICITY, CONSISTENCY, INTENSITY"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It's not supposed to be this hard. You're asking peoples opinion on something NO ONE here can answer for you. No one knows you from Adam. If you do the 3 day split, and you somehow find that it's not enough, I'd first ask yourself if you're even doing DC correctly and putting forth 110%, and THEN if it isn't enough, try 4 days. Don't overcomplicate a simplified, proven approach.
                        …Time is so precious….and you need to ask yourself, what are you going to do today but more importantly, you need to ask yourself – how are you going to do it?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Well as dc pointed out "The more times I can train a bodypart in a years time and recover will mean the fastest growth possible!" I have always tried to follow this philosophy while not going over the line of overtraining.

                          Looking over it again Dc in cycles for pennies was actually commenting on the fact he was doing the routine 2 days on 1 off and repeat. So that would actually be 5 days a week. When he made better weight gains physically and on the bar he needed a extra day rest so did it only 4 days a week.

                          I figure if I can keep up with not overtraining, the 4 day 2 way split would simply be in the end to produce possibly better gains then just the 2 way 3 days a week.

                          This is of course that I am not overtraining. But I am still in my prime years, focus on diet and rest/sleep heavily. Will watch my progress and will simply move down to the 3 day if tale signs of overtraining show up and I am not making gains on the bar every of the workouts.

                          My routine that I have been on for over 6 months by the way has been a split off pro muscle by a user named razorcut. It is heavily inspired by dante philosophies, and why I want to make the change to dc.

                          Here is the routine.

                          Upper A
                          Wide Grip Bench
                          D Flye

                          Bent Row
                          Straight Arm Pulldown

                          Over Head Press
                          S Lateral

                          Close Grip Curl
                          Hammer Curl

                          Close Grip Bench
                          Over Head D Extension

                          Lower A

                          Squat
                          Sissy Squat

                          Stiff Leg Deadlift
                          Leg Curl

                          Standing Calf Raises
                          Seated Calf Raises

                          Upper B

                          Incline Bench
                          Cable Flye

                          Pulldown
                          D Pullover

                          Shrug
                          Incline One Arm Lateral

                          Seated D Curl
                          Consentration Curl

                          Skull Crushers
                          Pushdown

                          Lower B

                          Leg Press
                          Toes Pointed Out Leg Ext

                          Stiff Leg Deadlift
                          Leg Curl

                          Dumbell One Leg Standing Calf Raises
                          Donkey Calf raises


                          Compound movement 2 sets after warm up, first set 4-6 reps and 10-12 second set. 1 set iso 8-12 reps.

                          done m/t and t/f

                          Later in my progression with this routine I would experiment with r/p and forced reps, along with statics.

                          Thanks a bunch for the help everybody.

                          Cheers



                          Originally posted by mentalflex View Post
                          In addition to knowing the weights you are training with, I would also be interested in know what types of programs you have used in the past, how you recovered from those workouts, your nutrition, how stressful is your job/life, amount of sleep and the exercises you plan on using for the 4 day per week split you are proposing.

                          With DC, when you push it to your absolute limit on the two-way, it is going to make you really want to take that extra day off (so you are only doing training 3 days per week). And training 4 days per week can wear on your joints and force you to cut your balst short. What do think would be better, doing the standard 2 way and stringing out your blast to 12 weeks or continuous gains in bodyweight, muscle mass, and training weights or going 4 days per week on the two way and having to cut you balst short thus limiting your growth and increases in training weight? These are just things to consider in relation to your recovery ability.

                          Another thing to keep in mind with training 3 days per week is that you can use your off days to do cardio so you are able to stay pretty lean while adding tons of muscle. I'm not saying you can't do cardio on the 4 day per week schedule, but how are your legs going to feel after doing widowmakers two days per week, week in and week out? So doing cardio in addition to the widowmakers will limit your recovery ability (I am talking about real cardio here, not 10-15 minutes of walking to get help with blood flow and oxygen).

                          Not trying to sound pompous or like an ass here, but I beleive I have a pretty good recovery ability and some weeks when my schedule forced me, I had to train every other day (so 4 days per week) and have been able to do so effectively but this only lasted about two weeks in a row and I can tell you that over a prolonged period of time, it would become difficult to keep up that level of intensity or not burnout mentally and physically.

                          Take some of the above points into consideration. I would still like to hear your responses to the questions I had because I am curious if you really would be able to handle a 4 day per week 2 way split and the reasoning you have for choosing to take on that challenge.

                          As for the original cycles for pennies:

                          http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthr...cycles+pennies



                          http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthr...778#post807778

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Once again we have someone who is gonna reinvent the wheel with DC Training....just do what you want man and don't bother posting about it. Lots of guys have come in here and told you how it should be, guys who have trained DC and know how its supposed to be done, and you're just ignoring their advice.....good luck
                            STEEL




                            "SIMPLICITY, CONSISTENCY, INTENSITY"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by steel1970 View Post
                              Once again we have someone who is gonna reinvent the wheel with DC Training....just do what you want man and don't bother posting about it. Lots of guys have come in here and told you how it should be, guys who have trained DC and know how its supposed to be done, and you're just ignoring their advice.....good luck
                              I do not want to bastardize dante's routine. This is why I made the thread inquiring why dante used the 2 way with more frequency and now he lowered it in the stickys.

                              It seems to me that dante only lowered the frequency due to his experience with the average joe's recovery abilities. Was just wanting to know if any one was still using the 2 way eod or m/t/th/f with success.

                              I know that dante says cycle for pennies and his old posts sometimes are outdated.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X