Standing Press for 5/3/1 (Grey, Sammi, Robb, Etc!!)

[trucelt]

Ive been using Wendlers 5/3/1 (actually the 3/5/1 for PL version) but i have an issue with the "Standing Military Press Day"....

I have some issue with my right shoulder (i dont have full ROM) and its hard for me to use a closer grip and "shoot my head thru my shoulders" to do a proper overhead press, when i try it tends to irritate my shoulder....

keep in mind i dont have any shoulder pain while bench pressing

so im going to make a decision to drop the standing press, at least for awhile until i can do a sh*t ton of mobility/prehab work on my shoulders. In the mean time what are some good replacement choices??

I was thinking:
*Seated BB Press (bench set at slight angle)
*Seated DB Press (" ")
*Bench Press- a speed day maybe 8x3:55-60%, currently i do zero speed work
*Seated Smith Military Press

im competing in july and I dont want to f*ck up my bench because i blindly stuck to an exercise that wasnt suited to me.....

[Adam2433]

When my military press stalled out I considered swapping it for incline bench or incline close grip. I figured the extra bench/tri work would benefit my bench and I could use laterals, shrugs, etc for more shoulder/trap work after the main move.

Never did it though so I don't know how it would have worked for me lol.

[Sammich]

I hate standing press. I suck at it, always have, and it hurts the fuck out of my bum shoulder. I've been doing seated BTN presses to the back of my head and that has been MUCH better for me.

Wendler's motivation for doing them is to build power and strength in the shoulders. But mine are pretty strong already, so I'm not that concerned about not doing that movement. I think really tall people are better off NOT doing standing BB presses, as the kinematics of it with long-limbed people are AWFUL.

What about trying something like a very high incline bench press?

[RobbHensel]

I agree with Adam and Nate, close grip incline or decline, smith military, standing db one or two arm variation higher rep ranges. We just got a swiss bar so I'm stoked

[Imprezivr6]

I love SOHP, but if I were to not do it, I think incline is the way to go.

[-AJA14-]

Wendler recommends incline bench.

I do SOHP but I suck at it. So I keep resetting and try to get better at it. I like push press a lot better, cause I can use more weight, but I don't do it.


Sammich, how tall is too tall, IYO, to do SOHP?

[Sammich]

Wendler recommends incline bench.

I do SOHP but I suck at it. So I keep resetting and try to get better at it. I like push press a lot better, cause I can use more weight, but I don't do it.


Sammich, how tall is too tall, IYO, to do SOHP?

Well, the only thing wrong with tall is that it tends to come with long-ass arms, which makes SOHP a bad exercise. That's because when the bar is at your shoulders your arms are incredibly bent, and the shoulder is in a very precarious position to apply sudden force.

[Imprezivr6]

I can't speak for everyone but one issue I see a lot is people not getting "tight" enough, especially in their upper back. IMO you need to retract the scapula, similar to a bench press.

[trucelt]

@Sammich....ahhh this makes sense. im 69.5 inches tall, but my wingspan is closer to 73 inches.

so alotta love for military press with slight incline to the bench or close-grip incline. i dont care about the exercise its a means to an end for me.Strong shoulder girdle for a bigger bench

[RedSkull]

I love them and I'm 6' with long arms. Sounds like you're just looking for an excuse not to do them truce! lol

Obviously for bench carry over seated barbell, dumbell, etc. is just as good.

[RedSkull]

Pretty good short piece by Dr Ken Leistner on the pros/cons of standing vs seated.

The Press: Seated or Standing?
One of my patients recently inquired if the overhead press should be done standing or seated. There are advantages and disadvantages to both methods, and there is no definitive answer.

The standing press requires you to control the bar and your body. There is quite a bit of indirect work given to the muscles of the low back and hips as the body is held in proper position. The compressive forces that affect the spine are, in part, dissipated through the lower extremities, providing some reduction of the forces which must be borne by the lumbar spine components. In many instances, however, the lumbar spine is still exposed to a great deal of compressive force due to the amount of weight being used and/or improper technique--a common occurrence when using maximum weights.

Many Olympic lifters who competed when the press was one of the three contested lifts suffered terrible low back pain and degeneration due to shearing and compressive forces which resulted from the technique used to elevate heavier and heavier weights.

Some trainees are poorly coordinated and do not expose the muscles of the deltoids and triceps to adequate workloads because they literally cannot control the bar or their bodies well enough to use meaningful resistance.

The seated press is, for many, safer, provided that support is given to the lumbar spine and upper back. The real disadvantage to this version of the press is that much of the compressive force produced by the overhead weight is not dissipated via the lower extremities. While the musculature of the lumbar spine may be under a bit less stress, the connective tissues may not be. The benefits that come with balancing the bar overhead are also reduced, although that may be a minor factor for the majority of trainees.

As I said, there is no definitive way to press. For almost all of my patients who have a history of low back trauma, I recommend the seated version, with additional support provided to the lumbar area with a rolled towel. If the available equipment allows, I have them keep their feet on the floor and a bit anterior to the torso, not behind it as is so often done. The new Nautilus Leverage Double Press machine is, perhaps, a great leap forward. Leverage factors allow heavy resistance to be used, while the seating angle prevents significant lumbar compression.

No matter how it’s performed, one has to maintain proper body position, and avoid excessive back bend and quick, jerky movements. The purpose of the press is to stimulate growth in the deltoids, triceps and other shoulder fixators, thus the emphasis must be placed upon those particular muscles. The only way to insure this is to use proper form and slow, controlled movement.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This article has been retained courtesy of Dr. Ken Leistner and CS Publishing Ltd. It was originally published in THE STEEL TIP Vol. 1, No. 7, July 1985. It was reprinted in the publication HARDGAINER, Issue #51 - Nov/Dec 1997. It is reprinted here on Cyberpump! with permission. No reproduction, photocopying or transmission of this article may be used without expressly written permission from CS Publishing and Dr. Ken Leistner. Any use other than for personal knowledge and instruction will be considered copyright infringement, and will be viewed and treated as such.

[MaxNat]

Seated Smith press (if your Smith press has the right angle for your mechanics), or Hammer Strength OHP (you can set the seat a little lower to take out the bottom of the movement for Condor-armed peeps, and work heavier in the top part of the movement).

[Imprezivr6]

Seated Smith press (if your Smith press has the right angle for your mechanics), or Hammer Strength OHP (you can set the seat a little lower to take out the bottom of the movement for Condor-armed peeps, and work heavier in the top part of the movement).

Eh....

Redskull what is your OHP up to these days?

[trucelt]

Actually Chris it's something I've considered dropping chest pressing for and making my "main press". However my right shoulder lacks the flexibility to come back so that my arms are next to my ear....if my hips are in front of my shoulders (ie seated at a steep incline) so that my arms come up slightly in front of my face no problem. ...

[RedSkull]

Actually Chris it's something I've considered dropping chest pressing for and making my "main press". However my right shoulder lacks the flexibility to come back so that my arms are next to my ear....if my hips are in front of my shoulders (ie seated at a steep incline) so that my arms come up slightly in front of my face no problem. ...

Yeah, I know what you're saying on this. I was just playing about avoiding them obviously.


Imprez- I did 264 for 3 on barbell and log both over the last few months, so probably about 285-290 for a single (never tried but the first rep with 264 was easy...)