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  • training priority- whats best scenario?

    Stats: roughly 10 yrs lifting- 5 seriously

    rough training maxes
    Raw bench: 350?
    raw dead: 515
    raw squat: high 400's

    Goals: strength and hypertrophy

    I lift with with westside style template. On max effort days it is working to a 1-3 rep max with some bar and some variation of the main lift.

    My question is this: If you are limited with time, would I be better off getting my max effort lift in and then doing some higher volume accessory work or cutting the weight back and getting more sets of the main lift in?

    an example would be

    max effort squat working up to a max double
    then a few sets of higher rep leg curls
    few sets of higher rep leg extensions

    vs

    max effort squat working up to a max double
    -drop weight down a bit and hit two sets of higher reps
    -drop weight again and do a few more higher rep sets
    then maybe change the style of squat like switch to a close stance for some more sets

    if you need anymore details please let me know, I just am curious what people think would be the best way to go about this given my current level of strength.

    thanks

  • #2
    Any squatting is gonna be better than any leg extensions...

    If pressed for time I'd get the most "bang for the buck" out of my assistance work and use big compound movements that would let me move a lot of weight. Sets and reps wise? Do whatever feels good that day... Feel strong, go heavy. Not so hot day... Back off and do some higher reps.
    Journal http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=51093

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    • #3
      Any squatting is gonna be better than any leg extensions.
      This x5

      Another option may be to include a couple movements as part of your warm up on a different day so lets say on bench day that part of your warm up includes a couple sets of GHR or something like that, no big movements here and volume must be paid attention to for the overall week.

      This goes along with the compound movement idea as well but lets say you perform some sort of squat on your max effort day, do some RDL's after and leave. If you do a deadlift do some narrow stance squats and leave.

      I may start rambling now but another option for variety depending upon how far out you are from a meet and your general condition is to hit the main movement hard as usual then do your assistance in circuit fashion. I do not believe this is better than the heavy compound movements for strength but when far out from a meet it will help raise your general fitness level and is not something you need to do for more than maybe 3-4 weeks out of every 12-15 weeks
      "You need never feel broken again"

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      • #4
        Thanks guys, I like that idea of max effort squat then some assistance rdl and vice versa. I also think If i start thinking about it as a training "week" as opposed to training "day" I might be better off. In other words i shouldnt be so concerned with getting in all my squat accessory on my squat day when I have 3 other workouts that week I can get some extra work in as long as it doesnt hamper my ME lifts.

        My squat day and pull day are 3 days apart and I tend to recover pretty quickly. Squat night tends to take us the longest as we have a few other guys that night due to us having a mono. I have opted to pull any accessory stuff from that night and dedicate it to the squat. I have added my accessory work (leg curls and leg ext) to my deadlift day. I know people will say leg ext are useless from a strength standpoint and that id be better off front squatting but they make my legs feel healthier and help with some added mass without beating up my back.

        I have also added in something I picked up from Jim Wendler and have begun doing a few chinups/pullups between sets on most days to keep my pulling volume up without adding in any extra time.

        I know none of this is the "best" way but its about adapting to what life throws you and still being able to progress that separates the people who will achieve more from those that will allow bumps in there life to doom them to a life of mediocrity.

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        • #5
          Try some step ups with the Yoke Bar in place of the leg extensions. Scott Yard is a huge fan of these and handles something like 3 plates for reps.

          They will not beat up your back and be a nice change of pace. Make sure you plant your toe then heel
          "You need never feel broken again"

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          • #6
            Originally posted by blastandcruise View Post
            Stats: roughly 10 yrs lifting- 5 seriously

            rough training maxes
            Raw bench: 350?
            raw dead: 515
            raw squat: high 400's

            Goals: strength and hypertrophy

            I lift with with westside style template. On max effort days it is working to a 1-3 rep max with some bar and some variation of the main lift.

            My question is this: If you are limited with time, would I be better off getting my max effort lift in and then doing some higher volume accessory work or cutting the weight back and getting more sets of the main lift in?

            an example would be

            max effort squat working up to a max double
            then a few sets of higher rep leg curls
            few sets of higher rep leg extensions

            vs

            max effort squat working up to a max double
            -drop weight down a bit and hit two sets of higher reps
            -drop weight again and do a few more higher rep sets
            then maybe change the style of squat like switch to a close stance for some more sets

            if you need anymore details please let me know, I just am curious what people think would be the best way to go about this given my current level of strength.

            thanks
            See above. IMHO that is a tall order. From my personal experience as a competitive powerlifter who is now working on some beach muscle....pick one or the other. I know this is not popular. Most guys want to think about getting big AND strong and point to freaks like Ronnie Colemen or Johnnie Jackson as examples. Note they are freaks, if you are reading this you are probably not a freak. I have found you either focus on power (heavy weights, low reps) or size (moderate weights, higher rep/volume). 2 years ago I weighed 175 and managed a raw 2x body weight bp, 3x body weight dead, and close to that in squat. But I didn't look big. Last 2 years I have worked on hypertrophy. I put on 12-14 lbs and am just as lean if not a tad leaner. Added size to my side delts, arms, and upper chest so I look bigger than my weight. That said, I am not as strong in my 1max rep in any of those lifts. My 10 rep max is better in squats for example, but overall I am not as "strong" as defined in powerlifting terms.

            Here is a pic of me now at 190ish and my avatar is of me at 175 on the dot:
            http://i49.tinypic.com/34g7fbn.jpg
            Last edited by Swaminator; 03-30-2013, 10:47 PM.
            Family Guy but also; Old School SoCal, punk rock loving, powerlifting, hardcore gym rat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtLQ73EutoY

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