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  • Sugar Intake on Higher Cals

    I was having this conversation today, and the question was posed regarding sugar on high cal (bulk, essentially) diets. How much sugar do/should bulkers eat when consuming 4-5000 calories?

    I looked at my macros, and on non-training days I get around 15-20g from incidental sugar, but typically no more.

    Do guys eating that much still get it all clean? How much sugar is too much? I hear stories of 1/2-1 gallon of chocolate milk A DAY, and this boggles my mind...
    You're perfect, yes it's true. But without me...you're only you.

  • #2
    Originally posted by RageBlanket View Post
    I was having this conversation today, and the question was posed regarding sugar on high cal (bulk, essentially) diets. How much sugar do/should bulkers eat when consuming 4-5000 calories?

    I looked at my macros, and on non-training days I get around 15-20g from incidental sugar, but typically no more.

    Do guys eating that much still get it all clean? How much sugar is too much? I hear stories of 1/2-1 gallon of chocolate milk A DAY, and this boggles my mind...
    fructose fills up liver glycogen from depletion at 50g i think

    then its spillover

    but what does sugar matter if on a bulk?? calories for growth is still growth

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    • #3
      Because I'm curious.
      You're perfect, yes it's true. But without me...you're only you.

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      • #4
        I eat about 4000 cals/day. My carb intake is around 350 g. Sugar is probably around 100 g.

        Where does the sugar come from? Gatorade during my workout (30 g), two cups chocolate milk post workout (50 g), vanilla greek yogurt (20-30 g).

        Now obviously 100 g of sugar is a lot and not ideal. But 70-80% of the sugar is placed around my workout window.

        I think that is the most important factor. A lot also depends on insulin sensitivity and activity levels. I train with weights every day which helps a lot with my insulin sensitivity, despite the fact that I am a bit high in body fat (~15%). If I weren't training every day and had "off days" I would try to cut my sugar to <30 g on the off days.

        At the end of the day hitting your macros is the most important thing, followed by food sources and nutrient timing. Is my setup ideal? No. But it makes my food a lot more palatable and that much easier to get the necessary cals.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by drcrappants View Post
          fructose fills up liver glycogen from depletion at 50g i think

          then its spillover

          but what does sugar matter if on a bulk?? calories for growth is still growth
          There is this thing called being healthy too... Execess sugar consumption can increase your risk of diabetes, the journal of American medical association states a siet that is comprised of 25% of the calories from sugar can decrease HDL levels, and constant spikes in insulin from sugar can lead to insulin resistance.
          Be true to yourself and fuel your body with nothing less the highest quality supplements. Only available at TrueNutrition.com Use discount code: KSP945 to save 5% on your order!

          Stickies...just read the damn stickies...

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          2014 Tracey Greenwood Classic Bantam Open - 1st
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          • #6
            The body will use any form of sugar to replace muscle glycogen if muscle glycogen is depleted. Just want to make that point because it gets lost a lot.

            Taking in sugar when depleted is not a risk for diabetes. Taking in sugar when not depleted is why our society is a bunch of fat asses with heart disease and adult onset diabetes. Which is not to say that mentalflex was saying otherwise. I am just making it a point lately to point out this information as much as possible because there are more people than I would have thought that think Skiploading is bad and that is not the case.

            Skip


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            • #7
              To answer the OPs question, I would question total carbs more than how much of it is simple sugar. I am not convinced that one is worse than the other.

              Skip


              Facebook: Skip Hill
              Instagram: @intensemuscle
              YouTube: TEAMSKIP
              TikTok: @intensemuscle


              For Training Inquiries: [email protected]

              Use discount code "SKIP" and get your TEAM SKIP protein here: www.TrueNutrition.com/TEAMSKIPblend

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              • #8
                Skip.

                Am I correct in thinking that Lactose and fructose are stored in the liver and are not used for muscle glycogen? even if MG is depleted?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ken "Skip" Hill View Post
                  The body will use any form of sugar to replace muscle glycogen if muscle glycogen is depleted. Just want to make that point because it gets lost a lot.

                  Taking in sugar when depleted is not a risk for diabetes. Taking in sugar when not depleted is why our society is a bunch of fat asses with heart disease and adult onset diabetes. Which is not to say that mentalflex was saying otherwise. I am just making it a point lately to point out this information as much as possible because there are more people than I would have thought that think Skiploading is bad and that is not the case.

                  Skip
                  Skip, I was not intending the statements I was saying to imply that using sugar as a tool to spike isulin around training or eaten semi-infrequently as in a Skipload are dangerous, but if someone makes a consistent habit of eating mounds of sugar on a daily basis, it will pose a risk. For example, if someone goes an long "bulk" phase, and eats sugar laden foods every day, then they may start seeing their health deteriorate or the potential for certain ailments may increase.

                  And to go along with what you said, if someone was in fact eating tons of sugar on the daily basis, they would not be in a depleted state and be able to use the sugar to resore normal glycogen. So yeah, we are on the same page here...
                  Be true to yourself and fuel your body with nothing less the highest quality supplements. Only available at TrueNutrition.com Use discount code: KSP945 to save 5% on your order!

                  Stickies...just read the damn stickies...

                  2014 Xcalibur Cup Bantam Open - 1st
                  2014 Tracey Greenwood Classic Bantam Open - 1st
                  2015 Beat Cancer!

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ken "Skip" Hill View Post
                    To answer the OPs question, I would question total carbs more than how much of it is simple sugar. I am not convinced that one is worse than the other.

                    Skip
                    I would agree 100%. Everything is going to get broken down to glucose eventually so whether is tarted as sucrose/dextrose/fructose/lactose/etc. I don't think will matter much.

                    Originally posted by mentalflex View Post
                    Skip, I was not intending the statements I was saying to imply that using sugar as a tool to spike isulin around training or eaten semi-infrequently as in a Skipload are dangerous, but if someone makes a consistent habit of eating mounds of sugar on a daily basis, it will pose a risk. For example, if someone goes an long "bulk" phase, and eats sugar laden foods every day, then they may start seeing their health deteriorate or the potential for certain ailments may increase.

                    And to go along with what you said, if someone was in fact eating tons of sugar on the daily basis, they would not be in a depleted state and be able to use the sugar to resore normal glycogen. So yeah, we are on the same page here...
                    I think one thing we have to keep in mind when talking about sugar consumption is how much fiber is in the diet. If you are taking in say 300g of carbs each day. There is a big difference between having 100g from sugar, and say under 20g of fiber, vs 100g of sugar but having say 50g of fiber. This is a big reason why fruit is very good for you, yet fruit juice is pretty crappy in my opinion because you are removing the fiber...
                    -2013 USAPL Michigan State Championships 198lb Raw Mens Open, 1st Place (1217 total)
                    -2013 USAPL Texas State Championships
                    198 Raw Mens Open, 2nd place (1216 total)
                    -2012 USAPL Longhorn Open
                    198 Raw Mens Open, 1st place (1177 total)
                    -2012 USAPL Aggie Showdown
                    198lb Raw Mens Open, 2nd place (1137 total)

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                    • #11
                      I live next to a nutritionist and they don't worry about gi index but glycemic load. Anyone care to elaborate? She did but I couldn't grasp it

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by RobbHensel View Post
                        I live next to a nutritionist and they don't worry about gi index but glycemic load. Anyone care to elaborate? She did but I couldn't grasp it
                        The Glycemic Load is the most practical way to apply the Glycemic Index to dieting, and is easily calculated by multiplying a food's Glycemic Index (as a percentage) by the number of net carbohydrates in a given serving. Glycemic Load gives a relative indication of how much that serving of food is likely to increase your blood-sugar levels.
                        GL = GI/100 x Net Carbs
                        (Net Carbs are equal to the Total Carbohydrates minus Dietary Fiber)


                        Read More http://nutritiondata.self.com/help/e...#ixzz2VMBkQe6R
                        You're perfect, yes it's true. But without me...you're only you.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RageBlanket View Post
                          The Glycemic Load is the most practical way to apply the Glycemic Index to dieting, and is easily calculated by multiplying a food's Glycemic Index (as a percentage) by the number of net carbohydrates in a given serving. Glycemic Load gives a relative indication of how much that serving of food is likely to increase your blood-sugar levels.
                          GL = GI/100 x Net Carbs
                          (Net Carbs are equal to the Total Carbohydrates minus Dietary Fiber)


                          Read More http://nutritiondata.self.com/help/e...#ixzz2VMBkQe6R
                          Thank you

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by RageBlanket View Post
                            The Glycemic Load is the most practical way to apply the Glycemic Index to dieting, and is easily calculated by multiplying a food's Glycemic Index (as a percentage) by the number of net carbohydrates in a given serving. Glycemic Load gives a relative indication of how much that serving of food is likely to increase your blood-sugar levels.
                            GL = GI/100 x Net Carbs
                            (Net Carbs are equal to the Total Carbohydrates minus Dietary Fiber)


                            Read More http://nutritiondata.self.com/help/e...#ixzz2VMBkQe6R
                            Like I said... Fiber matters :-)
                            -2013 USAPL Michigan State Championships 198lb Raw Mens Open, 1st Place (1217 total)
                            -2013 USAPL Texas State Championships
                            198 Raw Mens Open, 2nd place (1216 total)
                            -2012 USAPL Longhorn Open
                            198 Raw Mens Open, 1st place (1177 total)
                            -2012 USAPL Aggie Showdown
                            198lb Raw Mens Open, 2nd place (1137 total)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              quick aside: on nutritional facts labels, listed are Total Carbs and Fiber

                              say Total carbs listed is 25 and fiber is 2. Is net carbs 23, or is it still 25 (as in they already factored it in) for calories/macros?

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