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  • Help...Question for advanced people only

    Hey guys, my prep has been great so far. I'm actually stage read now, but I need to sharpen up a bit, and I know that I need to make welter.

    Right now I'm stuck at 172. My metabolism is pretty shut down. We were doing HIIT cardio 4x a week and I have included 1.5 hours of cardio a day, but nothing is budging. Here is the spartan diet:

    day1- meal- 8 whites, 1 cup veggies
    2,3- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies
    4- 8 oz white fish, 1 cup veggies
    5- 8 whites, 1 cup veggies

    day2- meal- 4 whites, 2 whole, 1/2 cup veggies
    2- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies, 1tbs flax oil
    3- 6 oz lean steak or burger, 1/2 cup veggies
    4- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies, 1tbs olive oil
    5- 4 whites, 2 whole, 1/2 cup veggies

    day3- mea1- 6 whites, 1/2 cup oats before cooking
    2- 6 oz. chicken, 1/4 cup rice before cooking
    3-6 oz. chicken, 6 oz potato
    4- 8 oz white fish, 6 oz potato
    5- 6 whites, 1 grapefruit

    The show is in 3.5 weeks, so I need to get on this. I was thinking about going pure keto and very low calories with a refeed. My coach is coming up with a game plan, but I was curious what some of our other advance trainees would throw out idea wise.
    1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
    2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
    2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
    2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
    2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
    2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

    Truenutrition.com
    Use Discount Code AMJ

  • #2
    Originally posted by Doberman View Post
    Hey guys, my prep has been great so far. I'm actually stage read now, but I need to sharpen up a bit, and I know that I need to make welter.

    Right now I'm stuck at 172. My metabolism is pretty shut down. We were doing HIIT cardio 4x a week and I have included 1.5 hours of cardio a day, but nothing is budging. Here is the spartan diet:

    day1- meal- 8 whites, 1 cup veggies
    2,3- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies
    4- 8 oz white fish, 1 cup veggies
    5- 8 whites, 1 cup veggies

    day2- meal- 4 whites, 2 whole, 1/2 cup veggies
    2- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies, 1tbs flax oil
    3- 6 oz lean steak or burger, 1/2 cup veggies
    4- 6 oz chicken, 1 cup veggies, 1tbs olive oil
    5- 4 whites, 2 whole, 1/2 cup veggies

    day3- mea1- 6 whites, 1/2 cup oats before cooking
    2- 6 oz. chicken, 1/4 cup rice before cooking
    3-6 oz. chicken, 6 oz potato
    4- 8 oz white fish, 6 oz potato
    5- 6 whites, 1 grapefruit

    The show is in 3.5 weeks, so I need to get on this. I was thinking about going pure keto and very low calories with a refeed. My coach is coming up with a game plan, but I was curious what some of our other advance trainees would throw out idea wise.
    Are You refeeding or SKIPloading at all? I don't know about supps either, seems super low in carbs and maybe your metabolism crashed because of that. More cardio probably isn't an hour unless you are going for stringy, gaunt aids patient look. Weren't you doing ADF? Some more info dobe, maybe higher GI carbs in place of those on Day 3
    For Training Inquiries go see the HNIC [email protected] anything else is uncivilized

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    • #3
      I was doing an alternate day diet (high day them a day under 500), but we changed to this to make weight. I' m not Skiploading. I' d like too, but I'm not sute of it's too late to implement. I agree more cardio is not an option.
      1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
      2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
      2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
      2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
      2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
      2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

      Truenutrition.com
      Use Discount Code AMJ

      Comment


      • #4
        have you considered dropping your protein some? Not that it is extremely high now. Just a thought.
        2005 HOA Natural Classic
        2006 OCB Midwest
        2007 ABA Natural Illinois
        2008 HOA Natural Classic
        2011
        NPC Mid-Illinois
        NPC Midwest Open
        NPC Natural Grand Prix
        2012 NGA Clash of the Titans
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        • #5
          Hmmm. Dropping protein. We have a meeting at noon (me and my coach). I'll bring that up, but what do I replace it with. I'd be worried of carbs would add water which would add weight. Adding fat might work but you wouldn't be able to add a whole lot of that because of the low amount of protein that you'd be able to take away.
          1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
          2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
          2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
          2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
          2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
          2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

          Truenutrition.com
          Use Discount Code AMJ

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Doberman View Post
            I was doing an alternate day diet (high day them a day under 500), but we changed to this to make weight. I' m not Skiploading. I' d like too, but I'm not sute of it's too late to implement. I agree more cardio is not an option.
            What FED are you competing in? rules, banned substances, if you are crashed, short of upping carbs or calories or severely reducing them may only make matters worse. Maybe a T2 supplement would help. Are you on any stims or supplements now? Making weight should come secondary to how you look IMO, I know the show you are doing is a huge show and usually stacked but sacrificing muscle at the sake of conditioning seems counter productive but I'm also not up to speed on what they look for either being out of the BB loop for a while
            For Training Inquiries go see the HNIC [email protected] anything else is uncivilized

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by DCBliever View Post
              What FED are you competing in? rules, banned substances, if you are crashed, short of upping carbs or calories or severely reducing them may only make matters worse. Maybe a T2 supplement would help. Are you on any stims or supplements now? Making weight should come secondary to how you look IMO, I know the show you are doing is a huge show and usually stacked but sacrificing muscle at the sake of conditioning seems counter productive but I'm also not up to speed on what they look for either being out of the BB loop for a while
              What he said. Is making weight worth sacrificing a better look? Sometimes you may be better off coming in at the lower end of a weight class and looking fuller than to be at the top of a weight class stringy and flat.
              -KidRok-
              "...because I won't accept that I can't."


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              • #8
                I was thinking about this a little bit more and I think we have more options than I really originally thought. I'm using fat burners so I don't think adding any other kind of fat burner is going to make a difference. I'm leaning towards doing a refeed and then switching to fish as my main protein source, but honestly I may be jumping the gun. I should just wait until after I speak with my coach. I do agree that I should not sacrifice Muscle for weght.
                1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
                2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
                2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
                2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
                2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
                2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

                Truenutrition.com
                Use Discount Code AMJ

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                • #9
                  I'm anything but advanced so I'm not going to chime anything in here. Just really curious what you decide to do. How much weight do you need to lose to make weight?

                  If you are "stage ready" now, any chance you could grow a little bit heading in so you are not at the bottom of the weight class?
                  Heavy squats fix everything.

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                  • #10
                    Actually growing into the weight class at this point really isn't going to be possible. I have spoken with some other people that I trust that told me to stop sweating it. They have convinced me that 7 lbs in 3.5 weeks will happen, and most of it will be water weight. A friend that is a national level female BB I spoke with told me she lost 12 lbs in two weeks by simply going to fish. We did that last show (fish and grapefruit) and lost quick without sacrificing much if any muscle. So if we do something like a small refeed and then go to the fish and grapefruit trick I think I'll be o.k., but like I said I'll have to see what the coach says. In the end Bodybuilding has just as much to do with your head as your body and at this point my body's messing with my head. I trust my coach, he's gotten me far, but I was curious about other peoples ideas before I spoke with him about things. Thanks for your ideas.
                    1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
                    2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
                    2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
                    2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
                    2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
                    2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

                    Truenutrition.com
                    Use Discount Code AMJ

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      My 2ยข

                      Switch protein sources over to fish.
                      Implement, 2x a week what has been dubbed the stubborn fat protocol:
                      - 20 min of hard intervals, 5 min rest, 45 min moderate steady state cardio
                      Skipload TODAY, then next Wednesday, the next, and finally the load before your show.

                      Any diuretics before show? You can load a few days before your show and drop the excess water plus a couple pounds pretty easily with a diuretic.
                      Want THE Magic Pill??!! Yea so do I!! Find the next best thing at trueprotein.com. For all your protein and supplement needs.

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                      2010 Grand Traverse Bodybuilding Championships: 4th, Tall
                      2009 Grand Traverse Bodybuilding Championships: 4th, Tall
                      2007 Northern Michigan Natural Championships: 5th, Light-heavy

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Doberman View Post
                        Actually growing into the weight class at this point really isn't going to be possible. I have spoken with some other people that I trust that told me to stop sweating it. They have convinced me that 7 lbs in 3.5 weeks will happen, and most of it will be water weight. A friend that is a national level female BB I spoke with told me she lost 12 lbs in two weeks by simply going to fish. We did that last show (fish and grapefruit) and lost quick without sacrificing much if any muscle. So if we do something like a small refeed and then go to the fish and grapefruit trick I think I'll be o.k., but like I said I'll have to see what the coach says. In the end Bodybuilding has just as much to do with your head as your body and at this point my body's messing with my head. I trust my coach, he's gotten me far, but I was curious about other peoples ideas before I spoke with him about things. Thanks for your ideas.
                        How stalled out is your metabolism?

                        If your current trajectory is downward at all, you'll likely lose a few more lb in the next 2-3 weeks and then you can drop water to make weight.

                        I wouldn't be concerned at all.

                        Pics would help to see how close you actually are.

                        -S
                        The Book Has Arrived!
                        The Book Has Arrived!

                        Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a pristine, well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, used up, worn out, and shouting, "Holy #$&^%$^... What a ride!!!"


                        www.TrueNutrition.com

                        2012 NPC Master's Nationals HW 5th. Mid-USA HW & Overall
                        2010 NPC Jr. USA HW 4th, Pacific USA Heavy 2nd
                        2009 NPC Mr. Arizona HW & Overall, Jr. Nationals HW 16th, Smoked at USA's

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                        • #13
                          Alright, we came up with the plan, and it sounds pretty good to me.

                          We are keeping training the same. Dropping HIIT cardio and only doing 15,000 total steps of LISS cardio a day. I was doing 20,000 and then hitting an additional 30-45 minutes at night.

                          Diet we are doing two down days which will be 500 calories, yup 500 hundo. Sounds extreme, but I'm pretty sold on the original version we were doing with the one up and one down.

                          Anyhow the up day will be 2500-3000 calories with 4-5 meals. The last meal will be a traditional carb up meal of potatoes, bananas, and oatmeal. This has worked well for me in the past. The meals before the carb meal will be protein+some fat (example 8 eggwhite omelete with 2 yolks and a cup of veges). I will be using eggs, fish and maybe a little beef, but we'll see. I am also taking liver, fish oil and aminos with each meal.

                          This should do the trick. I know in the past the original version we started with sounded crazy to me, but worked amazingly. I'm glad we are going back to a version of it.
                          1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
                          2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
                          2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
                          2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
                          2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
                          2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

                          Truenutrition.com
                          Use Discount Code AMJ

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Just saw you posted Scott. I'll try to get some pics up tonight. Maybe when I meet with Carlos tonight for his interview we'll have a pose down. Luckily, my legs have not suffered and continue to be a strong point. I do think I was on my way to that lovely stringy look we all dread.
                            1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
                            2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
                            2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
                            2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
                            2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
                            2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

                            Truenutrition.com
                            Use Discount Code AMJ

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Doberman View Post
                              Alright, we came up with the plan, and it sounds pretty good to me.

                              We are keeping training the same. Dropping HIIT cardio and only doing 15,000 total steps of LISS cardio a day. I was doing 20,000 and then hitting an additional 30-45 minutes at night.

                              Diet we are doing two down days which will be 500 calories, yup 500 hundo. Sounds extreme, but I'm pretty sold on the original version we were doing with the one up and one down.

                              Anyhow the up day will be 2500-3000 calories with 4-5 meals. The last meal will be a traditional carb up meal of potatoes, bananas, and oatmeal. This has worked well for me in the past. The meals before the carb meal will be protein+some fat (example 8 eggwhite omelete with 2 yolks and a cup of veges). I will be using eggs, fish and maybe a little beef, but we'll see. I am also taking liver, fish oil and aminos with each meal.

                              This should do the trick. I know in the past the original version we started with sounded crazy to me, but worked amazingly. I'm glad we are going back to a version of it.
                              Originally posted by Doberman View Post
                              Just saw you posted Scott. I'll try to get some pics up tonight. Maybe when I meet with Carlos tonight for his interview we'll have a pose down. Luckily, my legs have not suffered and continue to be a strong point. I do think I was on my way to that lovely stringy look we all dread.

                              Dobie,

                              If you're working with a coach, ignore any commentary of mine.

                              Glad you're on the right path!

                              -S
                              The Book Has Arrived!
                              The Book Has Arrived!

                              Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a pristine, well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, used up, worn out, and shouting, "Holy #$&^%$^... What a ride!!!"


                              www.TrueNutrition.com

                              2012 NPC Master's Nationals HW 5th. Mid-USA HW & Overall
                              2010 NPC Jr. USA HW 4th, Pacific USA Heavy 2nd
                              2009 NPC Mr. Arizona HW & Overall, Jr. Nationals HW 16th, Smoked at USA's

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