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Out of the box Bodybuilding Diet 2.0

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  • Out of the box Bodybuilding Diet 2.0

    OBBD 1.0

    Throughout the years I've had ADD with bodybuilding and diet. I then found a great coach that has worked with me for the last couple years. In that time we have had a diet and training template that has evolved instead of change on a whim. The last form of our diet was a little out of the box, which is why I refer to it as OBBD in this thread (Out of the box bodybuilding diet), but the name we usually call it is the UP DAY/DOWN DAY DIET. This is by no means completely revolutionary or unique. We basically took a little info from several other diets and put it together. This version included a high day, which was high carbs, high protein, and low in fat for all of the meals, but the last meal could include some fat. This last meal was similar to a Beverly refeed meal. The down day was primarily high in protein, moderate to low fat, and very low carbs. A typical calorie range would be 3000 on the up day and 1500 on the down day for an average of 2250 over two days. On this plan you would do training on the down day. I did mine in the morning and benefited from the glycogen from the evening refeed meal. This worked extremely well. I even put some muscle on while dieting. Toward the end we did have to go to doing cardio every day, but the majority of the cardio was just easy walking. For a short period we added in some HITT.

    ENTER OBBD 2.0


    The original version of the diet was borrowed from several sources, but one of the sources recommended almost no calories on the down day. This didn't sound right for bodybuilding and the original version was tweaked so that it might be more applicable to bodybuilding. Jeremiah, my coach wanted to see if he could make it better. He went back to some of the source material and revamped the diet once more. This may sound insane, but this version of the diet looks like this:

    example:
    High Day
    5500 calories
    • Pre training meal 500 calories (high carbs, moderate protein)
      Training is done about an hour after this meal after supplements are used.
    • High doses of BCAA and Glutamine pre and post workout.
    • Creatine and Beta-Alanine pre and post workout.
    • Post training meal 2000 calories (high carbs, high protein, low fat)
    • Meal #3 1000 calories (High carbs, low fat)
    • Meal #4 and #5 same as #3
      I should also note that carb sources do not need to be clean. We use processed carbs whenever we feel like it and it doesn't effect results.


    Down Day
    500 calories
    Do whatever you can to not eat. Pickles, lettuce, tomato juice, protein powder are fine, but just stay under 500. I use sugar free jello and soup as well.

    This sounds insane,but here are the results after a 6 week experiment. 194lbs @ 11% bodyfat was the starting numbers for Jeremiah. He ended at 194lbs @ 6% bodyfat. For the record he is completely natural and was the strongest he's ever been natural.

    I'm not a science guy, although I'm working on it, but I think some of the reasons for these results may be a combination of the following:

    1. Hormone release on the down day benefits fat loss and may even spare some protein loss.

    2. Hormone release on the Up day promotes anabolism. Primarily the high carbs helping the body to utilize the benefits of natural Insulin. This may explain the muscle gain we are seeing on this diet.

    Like I said, I'm not a science guy, but I really like this diet and have seen some great results. I was wondering if anyone else has tried this extreme approach and if anyone can jump in on the science of this.
    1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
    2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
    2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
    2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
    2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
    2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

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  • #2
    Thx for sharing, very insightful :-)
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    • #3
      Thanks, when I get a chance I'll link some of the research that goes with this.
      1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
      2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
      2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
      2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
      2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
      2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

      Truenutrition.com
      Use Discount Code AMJ

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      • #4
        similar to an alternate day fasting type diet?
        Owner of 316FIT and Team Skip Approved Trainer


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        • #5
          I'm pretty sure it's very close to the same thing. I'm not sure as I haven't seen it, but Like I said this may not be very unique, but I was very surprised by the results.
          1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
          2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
          2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
          2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
          2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
          2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

          Truenutrition.com
          Use Discount Code AMJ

          Comment


          • #6
            How very interesting. (Not being sarcastic at all)
            Ph.D., Theoretical Physics '16
            kind of a douche

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            • #7
              I think we're seeing more and more often that eating 6+ meals a day at super precise intervals isn't needed, especially for the athlete that doesn't plan on getting on stage.

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              • #8
                Funny how I was just thinking about something like this earlier yesterday. I had an idea that was somewhere along the line of eating a lot on workout days where anything goes as long as you hit your daily protein and caloric needs (didn't quite figure out how much daily calories yet) and on non-workout days, eat a small meal such as a few eggs...or some whey/pb or no food at all depending on how much you eat the previous day lol

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                • #9
                  I'm revamping an old school idea - REALLY old school that has some similarities with this, using myself as a guinea pig. I like it so far.

                  -S
                  The Book Has Arrived!
                  The Book Has Arrived!

                  Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a pristine, well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, used up, worn out, and shouting, "Holy #$&^%$^... What a ride!!!"


                  www.TrueNutrition.com

                  2012 NPC Master's Nationals HW 5th. Mid-USA HW & Overall
                  2010 NPC Jr. USA HW 4th, Pacific USA Heavy 2nd
                  2009 NPC Mr. Arizona HW & Overall, Jr. Nationals HW 16th, Smoked at USA's

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by homonunculus View Post
                    I'm revamping an old school idea - REALLY old school that has some similarities with this, using myself as a guinea pig. I like it so far.

                    -S
                    Care to share :tongue1:

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                    • #11
                      Interesting Scott. Now I'm curious. If you can share anything, especially what similarities your experiment has I'd love to know. What got me interested in this is how out of the norm from the normal bodybuilding dogma this is and then how well it seems to work, even for competitors.

                      Sammich, I'd be insulted if you weren't at least a little sarcastic. LOL.
                      1994 Ohio Gran Prix 4th place
                      2010 Kentucky State Championships 1st place
                      2011 Northern Kentucky 4th place
                      2012 Kentucky Grand Prix 1st place
                      2014 Francois Classic 3rd place
                      2015 Francois Classic 2nd Place

                      Truenutrition.com
                      Use Discount Code AMJ

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by shffl View Post
                        Care to share :tongue1:
                        Originally posted by Doberman View Post
                        Interesting Scott. Now I'm curious. If you can share anything, especially what similarities your experiment has I'd love to know. What got me interested in this is how out of the norm from the normal bodybuilding dogma this is and then how well it seems to work, even for competitors.

                        Sammich, I'd be insulted if you weren't at least a little sarcastic. LOL.
                        I'm trying develop (for myself at this point) a working modification old school coordinated program of diet and training. This similarity is simply that there is a dramatic dietary shift. Not as low as 500kcal in one day (at least not for some one who's >200lb), there is a range in daily caloric intake on the same order as a 5000 to 500kcal shift.

                        There was a diet called ABCDE by Bill Phillips (Anabolic Burst Cycling of Diet and Exercise) which didn't pan out too well, that had some major caloric swings. (This is not the one I'm playing around with.)

                        This is just for fun for me. After nearly 10yr of DC training, and not competing this year, I wanted to try some different things. What I've landed with so far is a major mind fuck, I'd imagine, for most folks b/c they'd not be able to stick with the large shifts in training styles and diet. (This I'm getting in part from the the results of the original program I starting working with. It didn't make it mainstream b/c it was just kind of too tough to carry out, to be honest.)

                        I like challenges, though and find crazy shit strangely fun. More later if its' worth posting, but I just wanted to chime in b/c what I'm seeing isn't a repartitioning effect per se (I'd not expect that after 28yr of training), but I seem to be making good progress.

                        -S
                        The Book Has Arrived!
                        The Book Has Arrived!

                        Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a pristine, well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, used up, worn out, and shouting, "Holy #$&^%$^... What a ride!!!"


                        www.TrueNutrition.com

                        2012 NPC Master's Nationals HW 5th. Mid-USA HW & Overall
                        2010 NPC Jr. USA HW 4th, Pacific USA Heavy 2nd
                        2009 NPC Mr. Arizona HW & Overall, Jr. Nationals HW 16th, Smoked at USA's

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                        • #13
                          Great read

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by homonunculus View Post

                            I like challenges, though and find crazy shit strangely fun. More later if its' worth posting, but I just wanted to chime in b/c what I'm seeing isn't a repartitioning effect per se (I'd not expect that after 28yr of training), but I seem to be making good progress.

                            -S
                            Hope to hear more from you on this. I am employing the intra-workout strategies you discussed in that recent article, and am currently trying out some different things with calorie/carb cycling for a 'lean' bulk.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DOHCrazy View Post
                              I think we're seeing more and more often that eating 6+ meals a day at super precise intervals isn't needed, especially for the athlete that doesn't plan on getting on stage.
                              I agree with this statement. If an athlete never plans on getting on stage, 3-5 solid meals a day is sufficient. Even something like 5500 cals a day, then 500 the next would be sufficient.
                              The only easy day is yesterday

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