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  • Need some help with diet

    I'll just post what I'm currently doing.. and hopefully get some feedback from that - just to confirm that I'm heading in the right direction, because I am really lost when it comes to this stuff.

    So, right now the macros I aim for are

    320g carbs
    450g protein

    and no added fat; fat usually comes in at about 60g or more. I can't afford to eat beef/pork atm so that's why fat is slightly lower than it has been in the last 9 weeks or so. Just to be clear, I count the macros in all the foods I eat, so I don't only count protein from protein sources, carbs from carb sources etc.

    So here's the plan.
    Right now I weigh 205lbs (@5'5"). Looking to get lean so I can start gaining again, properly this time.

    I like having protein comfortably high to make sure I'm getting enough, but I was planning to bring that down to about 350g to start with - it's probably unnecessary having it so high and protein costs more money than carbs/fats. I'd still be getting 1.75g/lb of BW. Is there anything inherently wrong with dropping it down that fast?

    I probably wouldn't want to lower protein even further after that, so the plan was to bring carbs down - I also don't want to bring them too low either. So once I get to about 200g carbs, the plan is to increase activity - morning cardio, etc. I think I'll get pretty far that way, but I don't really know what to do once I get to that stage, or if I will even need to go that far.

    I haven't got any refeeds/etc planned - not sure I need them since carbs are not low. I was going to wait until I got to the skiploading parts in the Longetivity DVD before making my mind up... but the last few weeks I have not had any cheat meals, though I have had some kids cereal. I think I'm better off without cheat meals tbh. I used to have them for the psychological aspect, but I don't feel the need for that anymore.


    One more thing, previously I was eating around 500g of steak or 750g of pork chops on most days, so obviously my calories were a lot higher due to fat content (this is the highest day I can find: 511g pro/326g carbs/212g fat - 5300 calories). Point being that I've already taken a hit in calories due to eating foods with lower fat. Despite this, I've gained a pound over the last week. Now, I just started taking creatine again last week (10g daily) so I'm thinking it's possibly due to that. Should I wait another week or so to make sure I don't have anymore unexpected weight gains?


    I don't want this post to get too long such that no-one reads it (I could ask questions all day long!), so if you have any questions please ask.

  • #2
    Would help if we know roughly what your bf% is. Obese? Fat? Lean? Somewhere in between? Also this is just me but that's a lot of protein and carbs IMHO

    Also, LOTS of free resources throughout the forum and internet. Do some work and dig them up

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    • #3
      Originally posted by shffl View Post
      Would help if we know roughly what your bf% is. Obese? Fat? Lean? Somewhere in between? Also this is just me but that's a lot of protein and carbs IMHO

      Also, LOTS of free resources throughout the forum and internet. Do some work and dig them up
      To be honest I have no idea. I'll try and get some pictures up by tomorrow. I'd say definitely not lean, i.e. I have zero definition - and never have had... but not obese either.

      Yeah, I know. I've got to admit I'm not familiar with the ideas floating around these particular forums so much, since I've been hanging around T-Nation for the last 2 years or so, but I don't want to waste any more time and I'm never going to be comfortable with what I'm doing on my first cut either way without some assurance.

      Basically the reason protein/carbs are high like that is because I decided to just go and do a routine already out there - I chose Max OT - and follow it without question, and their diet too which I believe is 10% fat, 53% protein, 37% carbs. I know the general consensus (at least in things I've read) is to get plenty of healthy fats, but I haven't noticed any adverse effects from having them so low...

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      • #4
        Originally posted by bodylifter View Post
        To be honest I have no idea. I'll try and get some pictures up by tomorrow. I'd say definitely not lean, i.e. I have zero definition - and never have had... but not obese either.

        Yeah, I know. I've got to admit I'm not familiar with the ideas floating around these particular forums so much, since I've been hanging around T-Nation for the last 2 years or so, but I don't want to waste any more time and I'm never going to be comfortable with what I'm doing on my first cut either way without some assurance.

        Basically the reason protein/carbs are high like that is because I decided to just go and do a routine already out there - I chose Max OT - and follow it without question, and their diet too which I believe is 10% fat, 53% protein, 37% carbs. I know the general consensus (at least in things I've read) is to get plenty of healthy fats, but I haven't noticed any adverse effects from having them so low...
        T-Nation is where I got started and learned many of the basics. Take advantage of the free articles they provide and apply them with reasons to your own diet and training. I know there are many great articles on cutting written by great authors. Look them up. Not many people are willing to give you specific instructions as to what to do but many will be more than willing to guide you in the right direction.

        According to the macros you posted, your total caloric intake comes out to roughly 3620kcals. Again I don't know about you but that might be too much for someone who wants to lose fat. Hard to tell because we don't know your exact composition. Taper it off slowly. Don't go dropping a lot of calories at once. Increase your fat intake, lower your carb intake slowly, and lower your protein intake over a course of time. Observe how you react to them. Look up what carb-cycling, timed carb diets, and keto diets are. Still IMHO I think your protein intake is too high...I don't think you need that much.

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        • #5
          Well... the thing is, if I just went by what all the articles say I'd change my training completely, jump onto carb cycling, do complexes and stuff like that, etc etc. OK maybe that works, but I know I just won't keep it up.

          I want something I can transition into - have a sort of "base diet", keep my training the same for as long as possible. I've tried carb cycling in the past and one part that I found difficult to deal with was prioritizing muscle groups (choosing high/low days) and getting into a routine, I just don't think I could stick with it for a long time.

          I know protein is really high, so you're saying I should aim to reduce it more slowly?

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          • #6
            watch Skips video Longevity, the diet portion. IMO Your macros are to high for your weight even for bulking let alone leaning out.
            2014 NPC Mr MN State TBD
            2012 NPC MN state 40+ 1st and 3rd Hvy *Injury :frusty:
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            2011 NPC Gopher State 40+ 1st and 2nd Open Hvy.
            2011 NPC Upper Midwest 40+ 1st and Super Hvy 1st
            2009 Gopher State 4th Hvy and 4th Masters 40+
            *11 Natural contest 1992-2000 placed top 4 of all
            88 Natural Mr MN 2nd Teen
            88 Gopher State 4th Teen Hvy Div 176lbs

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            • #7
              So I finished the DVD, and have completely changed the way I look at things now. Have been implementing all the stuff Skip talks about. My macros for the past week and a half/two weeks have been:

              300g pro
              220g carbs
              90 fat

              I did my first skipload last Sunday (its now Friday), and I'm still waiting to baseline (still about 3lbs heavier in the mornings, was around 5lbs heavier the morning two days after the skipload). I can post my current plan (meal breakdowns etc) but I'm not sure there's any point given the rest of my post.

              The point of this post is because I want to drop the fats and move to a higher carb approach. Ever since I started taking fats again I've had less energy in the gym, I can't concentrate nearly as well which is affecting work; I just generally feel worse off which is why when I was previously trying to get my diet in order - not sure how, it just sort of happened lol but - I ended up with 0 fats/trace fats and felt/looked better for it, so didn't bother adding them. It's also extremely impractical for me to go with higher fats since I dislike pretty much every source of fat..

              With moving to a higher carb approach it basically goes against everything I've ever read, so I've been looking for resources and stuff (things written by Chris Aceto etc) and I'm struggling to find anything other than maybe 1 or 2 example contest prep diets. So I just have a few questions.

              The basic plan for lowering calories is to drop 100g carbs and increase protein by 25g.

              1. Does anything change with regards to skiploading? I'd imagine that I'm not going to baseline very fast at all, because I will have plenty of carbs every day. The only difference I can see with the skipload vs regular diet is that I'll be using High GI carbs (outside of the post-workout window). However, I also remember Skip saying it doesn't matter what diet you're following, skiploading will work. Just wanted to make sure nothing changes in the approach (smaller window/drop protein from skipload meals/etc)

              2. So right now if I replace the fat-sourced calories with carbs, I'd be at 420g carbs, 300g protein. However, I was thinking that I should probably increase carbs to 520g and drop protein to 200g because this will give me more room to manoeuvre in the coming weeks (i.e. don't want to end up low carb/low fat/high protein), and with carbs high I don't need as much protein. Does this sound alright?

              3. I wasn't planning on doing cardio, HOWEVER, I was thinking that if I get stuck/stall at any point, that I'll do cardio 2-3 times the next week (AND ONLY THAT WEEK) to try and kickstart the diet and hopefully continue losing fat at the same caloric intake for a few more weeks thereafter. Would that even work? And is it a more sensible approach than simply reducing the calories right away? I've never dieted before so I don't have experience with this stuff, but to me it sounds preferable to simply reaching a very low caloric intake very fast as I imagine could happen with just reducing calories right away.

              4. How low should I let calories go before doing cardio? Or maybe a better question is, what factors help me decide that it would be better to do cardio than reducing the caloric intake any further? I haven't got a specific goal or end point date in mind, so I don't need to add cardio because I'm behind with a prep or anything like that.

              5. I read a post by Chris Aceto (Q+A thread at BB.com) where he said when you start losing weight (1-2lbs a week), a good thing to do is keep calories the same because you should continue to lose weight. However, a better thing to do is increase calories slightly, which may slow fat loss down but it'll be better or something-else-even-better-than-that-will-happen. I'm paraphrasing but that's the gist of it. So let's say I lose 1lb next week with the macros outlined above, is adding 25g protein a good idea? Has anyone else done this because I've not heard of it before?

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