Caffeine and protein absorption

[Ken "Skip" Hill]

I heard the other day, from a well respected local guy, that caffeine should not be taken with a protein meal because it gets in the way of absorption.

Now, I have to admit, if this is common knowelege I am going to feel stupid here but I have NEVER heard that and I know some top protein manufacturers that put caffeine in their protein drinks (mocha flavors, etc..).

Can anyone clear this up or point me in the general direction of some info that could validate this?

Skip

[Heckman]

I've never heard of this either. I would be curious to see where it came from. I've heard the same about calcium and magnesium. But a Doc friend of mine disputes it..Once again, I would have to see the documentation.

[midwtchamp]

This biologically just doesnt make sense tell that dude he is full of shiat....I will elaborate later client taking me out to dinner in a few though

[Ken "Skip" Hill]

Originally posted by midwtchamp
This biologically just doesnt make sense tell that dude he is full of shiat....I will elaborate later client taking me out to dinner in a few though

I won't tell him he is full of shit because he is well respected and he didn't come out and state it as fact as much as he said it in conversation. I didn't want to question him about it because I wondered if it was something that was so common that I didn't want to seem stupid by not knowing. lol

I do get your point, though. It doesn't make any sense to me, either. I would wonder what the rationale is behind his opinion.

Skip

[tpc]

the only thing i can think of, i know caffeine from coffee and other foods, can greatly speed up the gastrointestinal tract, which in turn can effect absorption of not only protein but all the other macro nutrients.

caffeine as well, has been know to block the absorption of other substances as well, like alcohol, calcium, etc. not only does it block absorption, in some cases it can speed up the metabolism of the substance to remove it from the body quicker.

i have not really heard anything regarding specifically caffeine and protein absorption, but i will do a few searches on med-line and pubmed and see if any studies were done.

tpc

[homonunculus]

TPC,

I believe it is not necessarily the caffeine in coffee that stimulates gastric acid production, but rather some other compound. (Can't recall what right now...)

Couldn't find much in humans, but a study in rats (1. Dubick, M. A. and A. P. Majumdar. Biochemical changes in the exocrine pancreas of rats fed caffeine. Proc Soc Exp Biol Med. 191:153-158, 1989.) chronically fed caffeine at levels intended to match normal human consumption had reduced sensitivity of the cells of their pancreases that produces the proenzyme of protein breakdown. This would mean a reduction in *rate* of protein breakdown and absorption.

This makes sense, given that caffeine (like eph., and clen) mimic the sympathetic nervous system, which generally inhibits digestions and absorption of nutrients.

I don't know that the caffeine would reduce protein biological value (less absorbed), but it certainly makes sense to me that it would slow digestion and absorption.

-Randy

[Ken "Skip" Hill]

Originally posted by homonunculus
I don't know that the caffeine would reduce protein biological value (less absorbed), but it certainly makes sense to me that it would slow digestion and absorption.

But would it be significant enough to even matter? I mean, given a normal person's caffeine consumption (not a 3 pot coffee drinker)?

I just don't see it being all that signficant.

Skip

[Trapzilla]

Bump for more discussion.

[rippedchef]

If my coffee is bad for me just shoot me now-

[midwtchamp]

Originally posted by rippedchef
If my coffee is bad for me just shoot me now-

Can we just shoot you anyway? :2guns:

[homonunculus]

Originally posted by Skip
But would it be significant enough to even matter? I mean, given a normal person's caffeine consumption (not a 3 pot coffee drinker)?

I just don't see it being all that signficant.

Skip

Me neither, except for people who tend to get upset stomachs from high protein intake. Even if absorption is just down a couple percent, the entry of that food matter into the large intestine could create a field day for the bacteria there. LOTS o' gas.

This may be the experience that your friend's noticed over the years - increased gastrointestinal misery in dieting BBer's after they've jacked up the caffeine in their pre-contest arsenal... May be the case for him, as well (which solidifies his opinion).

-Randy

[Ken "Skip" Hill]

Originally posted by homonunculus
Me neither, except for people who tend to get upset stomachs from high protein intake. Even if absorption is just down a couple percent, the entry of that food matter into the large intestine could create a field day for the bacteria there. LOTS o' gas.

This may be the experience that your friend's noticed over the years - increased gastrointestinal misery in dieting BBer's after they've jacked up the caffeine in their pre-contest arsenal... May be the case for him, as well (which solidifies his opinion).

-Randy

Now, THAT I can live with.

Rippedchef - I am with you, bro. I need my a.m. coffee with breakfast, prior to training.

Skip

[tpc]

Originally posted by Skip
But would it be significant enough to even matter? I mean, given a normal person's caffeine consumption (not a 3 pot coffee drinker)?

I just don't see it being all that signficant.

Skip

one thing i learned over the years looking at studies is you always have to look at both sides, one being clinical and technical and the other being a "real life" situation. there may be some obscure study somewhere stating caffeine does inhibit absorption of protein, but in real life it may be so minute it really doesn't matter.

as well the benefits of caffeine, green tea, coffee, etc by far, out weigh if your body absorbs 50 grams of protein over 51 grams of protein if you didn't use caffeine. hopefully this made sence.

from looking at some of the studies semi related to this, there is some truth to the statement, but nothing that really matters in "real life".

tpc

[KJB77]

Caffeine increases insulin resistance not sensitivity.

A pleasing blend
By mixing exercise with caffeine, you decrease your risk of insulin
resistance
by Sarah Haines
morning coffee may jump start your day, but it may also increase your
susceptibility to diabetes, say U of G and Queen's University researchers.
Felicia Greer, a PhD candidate in Guelph's Department of Human Biology and
Nutritional Sciences; Bob Ross, an associate professor in the Faculty of
Health Sciences at Queen's University; and Bob Hudson, an endocrinologist at
Queen's, have found that a high intake of caffeine can increase insulin
resistance.
This phenomenon is related to a low uptake of glucose in the cells. Insulin
is a hormone that helps cells take up glucose in the blood. People who are
insulin-resistant are more susceptible to diabetes, high blood pressure and
cardiovascular disease.
"The impact of insulin resistance will be more serious for some people than
others," says Greer. "It will depend on their age, lifestyle and level of
fitness."
The insulin-resistant study involved eight healthy but sedentary males
between the ages of 24 and 30. During the trials, the participants received
either a placebo or a pure caffeine pill (the equivalent of two or three
cups of strong coffee) after withdrawing from caffeine consumption for 48
hours. Their insulin resistance was measured after each pill was consumed.
The researchers found that after participants ingested caffeine, their
ability to take up glucose was reduced by 20 to 25 per cent, which
translates into increased insulin resistance. In contrast, the placebo had
no effect on glucose take-up.

[SuperSport]

Actually the American Diabetes Assoc. says that people that drink 3-5 cups of coffee per day have a 50% less chance of developing diabetes than non coffee drinkers. They say this is from improved insulin sensitivity.
If the caffiene creates insulin resisitance then it is certainly the magnesium that buffs that and creates the improved insulin sensitivity.....ADA says it expects it is in fact the magnesium doing the magic.

One highly respected MD also says that 1 cup of coffee has the antioxidant protection of 3 oranges.

Time for me to start up on coffee too I suppose....