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  • Police with wrong address shoot homeowner

    Twenty-six Andrew Lee Scott, Lake County Florida, answered the door of his home at 1:30am on Sunday morning. Because of the hour, Scott went to the door armed with his handgun. As he opened the door, not knowing who it was, he had his handgun pointed outside. He was shot dead by Lake County Sheriff deputies. The problem with all of this is that the deputies were at the wrong house.

    “When we knocked on the door, the door opened and the occupant of that apartment was pointing a gun at deputies, and that’s when we opened fire and killed him,” Lt. John Herrell said. “Even though this subject is not the one we were looking for when he opened the door. He was pointing the gun at the deputy and if you put yourselves in the deputy’s shoes. They were there to pick up someone who was wanted for an attempted homicide.”

    Here’s something interesting though, the deputies did not identify themselves to Mr. Scott for (insert drum roll here), safety reasons.

    The officers thought they were about to confront a man accused of attempted murder, Johnathan Brown. While Brown’s motorcycle was parked across from Scott’s front door and he had been seen in the area of the apartment complex that Scott lived in, officers failed to verify that he was actually the person who lived there.

    “It’s just a bizarre set of circumstances. The bottom line is, you point a gun at a deputy sheriff or police office, you’re going to get shot,” Herrell said.

    I’ve got something for Lt. Herrell. Bottom line is, if you are going into a house that you suspect an alleged criminal lives, why don’t you call it in and make sure the guy lives there. Why don’t you guys take 5 minutes to make sure who it is you are dealing with. I would also like to ask Lt. Herrell if he came to the door at 1:30am and no one identified themselves would he have gun in hand and ready to use it, or should he just assume it’s officers?

    The deputies did arrest Brown and another suspect, Anthony Rodriguez near the same building.

    While some neighbors expressed a sentiment that there was fault on both sides, the only fault I can see is on the part of the officers. Andrew Lee Scott is dead, not because he pointed a gun at deputies, but because he sought to protect himself in his own home from people knocking on his door in the dead of night that would not identify themselves.

    The Florida Department of Law Enforcement is investigating the shooting. The deputy who fired on Scott and the two who were on the scene with him are now on administrative leave, which means they are free and get paid, while Andrew Scott gets buried.
    Normally I side with the police in most situations, but I'm not sure in this instance.

    Opinions?
    Last edited by PBRevolution; 07-23-2012, 06:35 PM.
    My log: http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=47064

  • #2
    I'm still siding with the police....A simple "Who is it?" would suffice.....To open the door with a gun drawn and pointed outside is just fucking stupid.....I could be wrong, but something tells me that if he opened the door in this way that he has had some issues with people that were not good....

    Or how about just not answering the door at all? That seems like it would have saved his life as well....Sorry, but yes, every man has the right to defend himself, BUT, what exactly was this guy expecting when he opened the door? A knock on the door doesn't warrant opening it with a gun drawn and pointed at anyone. A knock on the door is not a threat, it's simply a knock....If it was gonna be a home invasion or something, I'm sure if they really wanted in there they'd just kick the door in....His whole response doesn't make sense to me....
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    • #3
      My guess is that the police violently pounded on the door at 1:30 in the morning, then stepped off to the side, hiding out of sight of the door. Guy steps out with handgun and police shoot him.

      IMO, the police should have identified themselves after knocking.
      My log: http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=47064

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      • #4
        The only problem I have with what you said is that had they been at the RIGHT address and identified themselves, that woulda turned ugly quickly. This really is a tragic thing, I'm not meaning to make light of it at all, but I just think there is a way to answer your door, and OBVIOUSLY that is NOT the way, under any circumstance that is not threatening....A pounding on the door for me would have had me peeking out a window with phone in hand ready to call 911....but everyone is different I guess....
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        • #5
          There you go guessing...you weren't there and neither was I, nor was the reporter. Pretty fucking easy to "monday morning quarterback" this after the fact. Everyone becomes an expert.

          I feel bad for everyone involved. But according to what I am reading, the police seem to have acted in good faith. What if they didn't shoot and now we are at another cop funeral? They were believing they were looking for someone who already showed them they have no problem trying to take a life...then a guy comes to the door with a gun. Not much time to sit there and have a conversation with the guy.

          If you have never worked in law enforcement, you can't really say what you would have done or how this should have been handled. Maybe the guy, if so frightened, should have looked outside, or called the police himself.

          I feel bad he died though, in what appears to be a tragic event.

          I usually don't respond to these types of posts/articles, but it annoys me when those who don't have a clue all of the sudden know what should have been done.

          edit: not trying to come off like an ass to you pbr...but it is something that drives me nutz
          Last edited by breck; 07-23-2012, 07:09 PM.
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          • #6
            And what hippy news site was this from? clowns..
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            • #7
              Breck,

              I agree with you, hard to judge from fifth hand news, I saw this a few days ago but this area was known for having less than stellar tenants. Pretty sure he had a window to look out also. I know when we served warrants we didn't knock on the door and say who we were so we could get blaasted through the door, but hey that was just the NYPD, we did announce when we kicked your door in though.
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              • #8
                Originally posted by steel1970 View Post
                The only problem I have with what you said is that had they been at the RIGHT address and identified themselves, that woulda turned ugly quickly. This really is a tragic thing, I'm not meaning to make light of it at all, but I just think there is a way to answer your door, and OBVIOUSLY that is NOT the way, under any circumstance that is not threatening....A pounding on the door for me would have had me peeking out a window with phone in hand ready to call 911....but everyone is different I guess....
                If the cops were too worried to identify themselves, then shouldn't they have called a tactical unit like SWAT in? Who knows if this man ever even saw their police uniforms before being shot.

                In hindsight calling 911 would be a better decision, but that's easy to say just sitting here, not while having someone pounding on your door in the middle of the night.

                Originally posted by breck View Post
                There you go guessing...you weren't there and neither was I, nor was the reporter. Pretty fucking easy to "monday morning quarterback" this after the fact. Everyone becomes an expert.

                I feel bad for everyone involved. But according to what I am reading, the police seem to have acted in good faith. What if they didn't shoot and now we are at another cop funeral? They were believing they were looking for someone who already showed them they have no problem trying to take a life...then a guy comes to the door with a gun. Not much time to sit there and have a conversation with the guy.

                If you have never worked in law enforcement, you can't really say what you would have done or how this should have been handled. Maybe the guy, if so frightened, should have looked outside, or called the police himself.

                I feel bad he died though, in what appears to be a tragic event.

                I usually don't respond to these types of posts/articles, but it annoys me when those who don't have a clue all of the sudden know what should have been done.

                edit: not trying to come off like an ass to you pbr...but it is something that drives me nutz
                Unfortunately the guy is dead so we can't hear his side of the story, all we have to go on is the cops testimony. And as we have seen, police will never admit guilt when there is injury or death involved. And many cops won't hesitate to cover for their buddies as we have seen in high profile cases like Rodney, or Katrina. Why would an officer ever admit guilt when there is no other evidence?

                For all we know, the officers could have been standing off to the side, homeowner peeks out his door after seeing no one in front of it. First thing he see is an officers gun since that would obviously be the closest thing to him.

                At this point it is NOT an officer, but a stranger with a gun pointed at him. He pulls his gun and the officer fires. He may have never saw the officers uniform before seeing the gun and reacting.

                The guy may have never even noticed he was a cop before being shot, his last thoughts may have been that a thug was robbing him at gun point.

                I doubt the officers statement about the homeowner pointing the gun at the officer when he opened the door. Why wasn't the officer shot if this was the case?''

                I think it may have just been a jumpy officer who was too quick to pull the trigger, but we will never know since the only other witness can't tell his side.

                Originally posted by breck View Post
                And what hippy news site was this from? clowns..
                Saw it in a national news feed, Reuters IIRC. He is a link to a police forum, http://www.policeone.com/officer-sho...wrong-suspect/
                My log: http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=47064

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                • #9
                  IF its true police were at wrong house they fucked up, thier fault.

                  Damn be compitent at your job.
                  Last edited by lhart6272; 07-23-2012, 10:51 PM.
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PBRevolution View Post
                    If the cops were too worried to identify themselves, then shouldn't they have called a tactical unit like SWAT in? Who knows if this man ever even saw their police uniforms before being shot.

                    In hindsight calling 911 would be a better decision, but that's easy to say just sitting here, not while having someone pounding on your door in the middle of the night.



                    Unfortunately the guy is dead so we can't hear his side of the story, all we have to go on is the cops testimony. And as we have seen, police will never admit guilt when there is injury or death involved. And many cops won't hesitate to cover for their buddies as we have seen in high profile cases like Rodney, or Katrina. Why would an officer ever admit guilt when there is no other evidence?

                    For all we know, the officers could have been standing off to the side, homeowner peeks out his door after seeing no one in front of it. First thing he see is an officers gun since that would obviously be the closest thing to him.

                    At this point it is NOT an officer, but a stranger with a gun pointed at him. He pulls his gun and the officer fires. He may have never saw the officers uniform before seeing the gun and reacting.

                    The guy may have never even noticed he was a cop before being shot, his last thoughts may have been that a thug was robbing him at gun point.

                    I doubt the officers statement about the homeowner pointing the gun at the officer when he opened the door. Why wasn't the officer shot if this was the case?''

                    I think it may have just been a jumpy officer who was too quick to pull the trigger, but we will never know since the only other witness can't tell his side.
                    Ballsy of you to say this to Breck. Especially after he said

                    If you have never worked in law enforcement, you can't really say what you would have done or how this should have been handled. Maybe the guy, if so frightened, should have looked outside, or called the police himself.

                    I feel bad he died though, in what appears to be a tragic event.

                    I usually don't respond to these types of posts/articles, but it annoys me when those who don't have a clue all of the sudden know what should have been done.


                    Based on this nonsense you posted talking shit about the cops I can confidently say I am happy you never stood behind me when I had to kick in a door and clear a house. Anyone who judges like that without ever been in that situation is most definitely a shit talking pussy.
                    Journal http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=51093

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                    • #11
                      Adam, I understand your sentiment, but please try to keep things civil in here....There's no reason we shouldn't be able to discuss stuff like this without it going downhill....

                      That being said, I realize the cops made a mistake, but I know that I certainly wouldn't answer my door like that....
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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Adam2433 View Post
                        Ballsy of you to say this to Breck. Especially after he said

                        If you have never worked in law enforcement, you can't really say what you would have done or how this should have been handled. Maybe the guy, if so frightened, should have looked outside, or called the police himself.

                        I feel bad he died though, in what appears to be a tragic event.

                        I usually don't respond to these types of posts/articles, but it annoys me when those who don't have a clue all of the sudden know what should have been done.


                        Based on this nonsense you posted talking shit about the cops I can confidently say I am happy you never stood behind me when I had to kick in a door and clear a house. Anyone who judges like that without ever been in that situation is most definitely a shit talking pussy.


                        Were people wrong to question the police in the Katrina shootings? Good thing they didn't blindly believe the police in that occasion, or otherwise the police would have been successful in sweeping the incident under the rug.

                        Questioning of the police is NECESSARY to keep them in check.
                        Last edited by PBRevolution; 07-23-2012, 10:51 PM.
                        My log: http://www.intensemuscle.com/showthread.php?t=47064

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                        • #13
                          My partner and I once went to a female armed with a knife job. We get to the unit block and confirm where she was last seen and description of her. We head into the park and start searching.
                          It's misty and hard to see and then this female just runs at us yelling. I look in her hand and can see some highly reflective thing I think is a knife. I'm yelling drop the knife and so is my partner.

                          In short we draw and nearly shoot some lady lookng for her lost dog who is holding a shiny chain. She is yelling at us thinking it is her kids comming out again after she told them several times to go back to bed. She didn't hear us yelling at her due to being so worked up. We realised it was a chain when she was about 3m away and still closing.

                          We calm down and later find the armed lady and spray her and take her under arrerst. We didn't do anything wrong in nearly shooting the first lady. All we were doing is answering a call and acting in good faith to protect ourselves and community.

                          If we shot her I'm sure we would have been in trouble from every person under the sun. Do you know why I never shot her..... I hadn't been practicing my shooting whilst holding a torch drills so my reaction time was off. If I had of been up to scratch I am sure I would have dusted her.

                          My partner is a shit shot so they got their gun out but said they would have needed another couple of seconds to fire.

                          Every cop has stories like this, how they nearly killed someone except for.....

                          This cop has a story of how he did kill the wrong guy. Don't be surprised if that cop and his partner never want to work again. Just like the persondriving who kills someone who steps out in front of them. I feel bad for everybody.
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                          • #14
                            PBR, the question I have for you is...... How do you know it didn't happen EXACTLY as the officers claimed it did? Are we suppose to automatically assume he is lying and blame him simply because the other guy isn't alive to tell his side of the story?


                            Let's say you are sitting at home and hear a gunshot next door. You are friends with the neighbors and are concerned, so you grab your shotgun (possibly not the smartest choice, but you feel like they may need immediate help) and go running over to investigate. As you are approaching the front door, someone comes running out with a gun pointed at you. You instinctively fire and kill them; it was your neighbor. You later find out that your neighbor had wrestled the gun from the intruder and was fleeing to safety out the front door. He thought you were an accomplice, and pointed the gun at you when you shot him.

                            Are you at fault? Possibly.
                            Was the situation complicated? Definitely
                            Should there be an investigation into what happened? Absolutely.
                            Should we assume that you are lying and went over there to rob and shoot him simply because he isn't alive to tell his side of the story? My guess is no?




                            Edit: I wanted to add a response to your post about the necessity of questioning police. Where has anyone here said that we should blindly believe what police say without looking into it further? I will tell you where, nowhere.

                            What you are doing isn't questioning police, you are outright accusing them. Huge difference.
                            Last edited by Macho Man; 07-23-2012, 11:04 PM.
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                            • #15
                              I have a feeling that this thread is gonna get locked guys.....This is why threads like these don't work here. We are all emotional people and our emotions come thru in our posts....AND, anything that ANY of you will post is purely OPINION based, unless someone who is a cop, Like Breck, states something about procedure or what not......Everyone can have an opinion, but like Breck, I think to be quick to judge the cops involved when they had a gun pointing at their face is irresponsible at best....again, my OPINION.....how they were at the wrong house is another story. I'm sure the cops at the scene, didn't do their own intell on where they guy was at, they were prob given the wrong info from an investigator or what not....Totally not their fault I'm sure, and I'll be honest, if a guy points a gun in my face and I have my own gun I'm shooting that fucker, cause at that point it's kill or be killed.....
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