Family issues

[steel1970]

I am at my wits end with my 12 year old son.....There are times when he is such a nice young man, but there are far more times when, to be completely honest, he acts like a complete asshole.....I don't know what I am doing wrong here. My biggest fear is that he's gonna take the path that I took at his age and have serious trouble ahead of him. He is a great kid for the most part. Last report card he was only 2 points away in one subject from having straight A's.....he is involved in sports year round and excels in them, not due to being athletically gifted, but because he works hard and doesn't fuck around.....With all that being said, you are probably all wondering what the hell I'm complaining about....lol. It's his attitude, and the way he treats his sisters....The way he prioritizes certain things over others.....Back talk....being rude and obnoxious....Honestly, he was not like this, at least to this extent, until he started middle school this past year, and then it seems to have gone downhill, fast.....

I don't know what to do...I've talked with Skip about it on several occasions, just to have an ear that will listen. He's also given me good advice. I just get so pissed off at times at him that I'm ready to slap the piss out of him....But I know that will just alienate him from me.....I just don't want all this friction between us, and to me, it seems like it's starting a bit early....I've talked with him about this and how things are affecting US, and he seems sad when we talk and apologetic, but then it's usually back to square one a day or so later...

Any suggestions?

[liftweights]

Find out who his friends are. Guarantee they are doochebags influencing your son to behave that way.

[JohnnyBravo]

Steel, I did the exact same thing as your son when I first started middle school. Around 7th grade, I started being pretty disinterested in what my parents and teachers had to say, being kind of a dick (despite good grades and playing sports). I had other issues, but thats not the point.

My parents handled it really badly. DO NOT try to get him to behave out of fear. It WILL alienate him, make him mad and probably rebel worse privately even if he gets better publicly. IMO (and I dont know all the info here) he wants to get girls and be cool among the guys. I give him more freedom, with the caveat that if he keeps actign like a fuckhead, he loses it. Maybe extend his curfew, etc, but let him know that if he wants to keep it, he needs to be nicer to his family. With the grades, I can't say for sure, but I felt immense pressure socially to not try in school. I don't really know how to solve that.

That was all mostly stream of consciouness/my own experience, so take it with a grain of salt, but if you want more advice from someone who can actually remember being in middle school (lol), PM me or ask here.

[steel1970]

Find out who his friends are. Guarantee they are doochebags influencing your son to behave that way.

I know them all already. I have coached most of them in one kind of sport or another for years....Most SEEM to be ok, but their parents may be feeling the same way...I always think that you act out where you are most comfortable. It certainly seems like that's the case, since he's really never gotten into any trouble other than at home....

[steel1970]

Steel, I did the exact same thing as your son when I first started middle school. Around 7th grade, I started being pretty disinterested in what my parents and teachers had to say, being kind of a dick (despite good grades and playing sports). I had other issues, but thats not the point.

My parents handled it really badly. DO NOT try to get him to behave out of fear. It WILL alienate him, make him mad and probably rebel worse privately even if he gets better publicly. IMO (and I dont know all the info here) he wants to get girls and be cool among the guys. I give him more freedom, with the caveat that if he keeps actign like a fuckhead, he loses it. Maybe extend his curfew, etc, but let him know that if he wants to keep it, he needs to be nicer to his family. With the grades, I can't say for sure, but I felt immense pressure socially to not try in school. I don't really know how to solve that.

That was all mostly stream of consciouness/my own experience, so take it with a grain of salt, but if you want more advice from someone who can actually remember being in middle school (lol), PM me or ask here.

Thanks...this post gives me a bit of good insight....I'm so old I can't remember when I was 12, and honestly, growing up in the 80's is FAR different than growing up today....lol

[Jared Ragsdale]

Find out who his friends are. Guarantee they are doochebags influencing your son to behave that way.

No doubt whatsoever.


There was an interesting class I took in college back in the day. It was called Applied Behavioral Science.. It looked at things like positive reinforcement, negative reinforcement, extinction, etc.. and used it with kids. Autistic kids in particular.

They could elicit the response they wanted from the kids and adults, just by the way they reacted to the kids.

Think about things like reinforcement.. There are two types - negative and positive. Positive reinforcement, you are reinforcing a good behavior - like getting good grades - with praise, attention, etc.

The same is true about negative reinforcement.. There are times that behaviors that we don't like are reinforced by our behavior simply because we acknowledge them. A kid throwing a fit about something gets reinforced when you give him attention... Even though may be beating their ass, it got a response from you and that was truly what they wanted.


I hope I didn't butcher that too much.. Surely, there is some sort of book that uses these principles on teaching parents how to reinforce good behavior and extinguish negative behaviors.... I'll keep my eyes peeled.


edit: I'm emailing my old professor to see if there is anything he recommends to read up on. I'll keep anyone posted who is interested.

[theroymccoy]

Hormones mang...I remember when I was around that age and I was an asshole to my parents for no reason. Also if he's 12 that makes him in...7th grade? At least for me, it was kind of a weird transition...being the "big dog" in elementary school then thrust into middle school...his paradigm is expanded. I know you guys are probably chuckling but really, from elementary to middle school can be weird depending on how you handle it.

I'd say he's frustrated with the change, trying to make sense of his feelings or whatever that come with a new experience (entering middle school) and a changing mind/body (puberty).

You're a good dad...having talks and what not. Hell everything else seems to be on point (grades, sports) I'm sure it'll be fine.

[mark!]

I'm at the same point with my 13 year old step son. He's really good for the most part, but has his wtf moments every now and then. We've been working with him, we sit around with him and have good talks about how his attitude effects his brothers and how it makes us feel. He's been pretty good after we started treating him more grown up and giving him more responsibility. We also make it a point to let him choose things for himself and have say so in things. He acts more grown up and more mature since we gave him said freedoms.

[grammo13]

Me too, my parents and I absolutely hated each other when I was twelve. My dad worked on the road and me and my mom couldn't speak without fighting. The older I get the closer we get and all that crap is in the past. Its just a stage, and as long as your there as the father you are, I would bet on him coming out on the right side of it


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[maddzz]

I have a 20yo, a 13yo, and a 4yo. What you have to remember also is that from the age of 12-19 you know everything. So, based on this logic, it is irritating when adults try to point things out that you already know. With all the good points you mentioned you have to "not sweat the little things" and give him his space. If his sisters are younger than him, then giving them attitude is just his way of separating himself from the "babies" because he is now "grown". I went thru this with my oldest and am going thru it now with my 13yo. I feel your pain, bro.

[steel1970]

All good info from everyone here, thanks fellas...Fade, just got off the phone with a mutual friend and he pushed the reinforcement as well, thru his own experience....It def seems to be a major influence, for sure....

Maddzz, its funny that you say that about knowing everything. Tonite, Zach (my son) and I got into it over his prioritization of some things going on tonite....It wasn't good, the exchange between us....Well, I kinda blew it off, and later I'm on my way to the bathroom and he's coming out, turns around and closes the window. I asked why he had the window open. A few weeks ago it was warm here, and we had alot of windows open. He couldn't understand why the bathroom door was shutting so easily, so I tried to explain to him about the movement of air in/out thru the window is allowing the door to shut/open easier while the window is open....So tonite, after our spat, I guess he had to do an experiment to see if I was right or not...he explained that he was trying to see if that was true, what I told him...lol. The little prick thinks I'm bullshitting him or he just didn't believe me.....That's kinda fucked up....lol

It's funny, but I remember getting into it with my parents and hating them for years....I certainly hope it doesn't get THAT bad for him and I.....

[Macho Man]

Steel, it was my job for a few years to counter behavior exactly like this and get guys to do the things I wanted without having power to do ANYTHING to them if they didn't. I am by no means saying I know exactly what to do, but I have been around this block a few thousand times. It won't be until later tonight, but when I get a chance, I will share my thoughts on it.

[steel1970]

Steel, it was my job for a few years to counter behavior exactly like this and get guys to do the things I wanted without having power to do ANYTHING to them if they didn't. I am by no means saying I know exactly what to do, but I have been around this block a few thousand times. It won't be until later tonight, but when I get a chance, I will share my thoughts on it.

Cool....different perspectives are what I need, and all are welcome...what I'm doing now, well, it's not working so well....

[Jared Ragsdale]

Steel, it was my job for a few years to counter behavior exactly like this and get guys to do the things I wanted without having power to do ANYTHING to them if they didn't. I am by no means saying I know exactly what to do, but I have been around this block a few thousand times. It won't be until later tonight, but when I get a chance, I will share my thoughts on it.

This is why you don't like it when we say the word "retard" isn't it...

[maddzz]

Without knowing how strict you are, I think its still safe to say it probably wont come to him hating you. I think most parents nowadays take into consideration how they felt when certain things were done to them by their parents for good or bad, and use that to base their decisions on with their kids. The older generation seemed to see things more in black and white and what was good for them when they were kids was good for us. I tend to try and guide my kids rather than force them (altho, a lot of the time I am forcing them; they just dont know it)