the truth about stretching...

rubinsteinnyc · 04-15-2007, 12:57 AM

...I am getting certified as a personal trainer at ECITS organization. One of the guys that is teaching the class is a highly acclaimed personal trainer got certificates from ACSM and others...
today, he was talking about static stretching... and he stated THAT it is dangerous EVEN in between sets... claims that it only adds to the trauma of the worked muscle, tearing it up... i was stunned and speechless... i told him how it adds to the fullness of the muscle, and helps recovery and all... he was just shaking his head... do not flame me, it's just an opinion of a guy who trains the navy, pro football, basketball, baseball teams... comp. fitness figure women

any comments?

boondocksmuscle · 04-15-2007, 01:09 AM

some ppl just dont believe in it...i didnt at first...but after i actually tried it consistently i really like it...but if someone is uneducated then they might take it to far and injure themselves...but that can happen with anything...just my opinion

mhschiefs97 · 04-15-2007, 01:13 AM

He was completely against all stretching? I am not big on stretching a body part until it is already finished being worked out and that works awesome for me. I do agree with him that you are just adding to the trauma by stretching a body part in the middle of working it out. There are exceptions though. That is just my opinion though.

prolangtum · 04-15-2007, 02:09 AM

everyone is entitled to their opinion. Maybe there is some science to what he has to say......but results are results....and for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work.

Phil1369 · 04-15-2007, 05:28 AM

Why have all the osteopaths and chiropractors I've dealt with recommended it ?
They all warn against stretching a cold muscle.

Cerberus · 04-15-2007, 09:39 AM

Context, context, context. To completely statisfy a good argument, we need more substance to work with. Generalizations are killers. i.e. stretching a cold muscle. (btw, is actually a good method of stretching if applied correctly)

**homonunculus** · 04-15-2007, 10:19 AM

Pretty simple - just provide some scientific references and/or evidence (before and after pictures for instance) for these statements:

"static stretching... and he stated THAT it is dangerous EVEN in between sets..."

"for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work."

-R

horsepower · 04-15-2007, 10:37 AM

Perhaps he was referring to an already injured muscle

--I can imagine how excessive static stretching could exacerbate a problem.

prolangtum · 04-15-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homonunculus

"for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work."

-R

scientifiically proven, no....anedoctally yes. Whenever I train DC style I notice hypertrophy in certain areas where I feel the "stretch" when doing the weighted stretches. Quads, chest, and biceps particularly. I know im not alone in this area.

04-15-2007, 12:17 PM

i can feel the stretch in my chest, lats, bis and quads the most but have big difficulties in stretching other body parts and notice a faster growth in the "better stretched" body parts

tadams · 04-15-2007, 12:27 PM

There are a bunch of studies that have come out recently that have said static stretching a muscle group immediately before weightlifting can increase the risk of injury, i guess he could be referring to one of these. I even saw an article written by Charles Poliquin that said the same thing. The problem with a lot of these studies is that they have conflicting results. Lets not forget about all the studies that talk about protein consumption and how almost every one says high protein diets are useless and you can only take in something like .8g/ lb bodyweight.

Sentinel · 04-15-2007, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tadams

There are a bunch of studies that have come out recently that have said static stretching a muscle group immediately before weightlifting can increase the risk of injury, i guess he could be referring to one of these. I even saw an article written by Charles Poliquin that said the same thing. The problem with a lot of these studies is that they have conflicting results. Lets not forget about all the studies that talk about protein consumption and how almost every one says high protein diets are useless and you can only take in something like .8g/ lb bodyweight.

good points there

rubinsteinnyc · 04-15-2007, 10:14 PM

actually, i asked HIM and other guy who is there for re-cert. (competitive PL and BBer) and i asked him " do you tell your clients to stretch the bodypart they were workin on after they are done?" he said "NO"...

-homonunculus- ill ask him for the scientific data on which he bases his statement.

bhman6 · 04-15-2007, 10:42 PM

maybe he was referring to stretching heavily BEFORE a workout or game, which has been shown to reduce work output

rubinsteinnyc · 04-16-2007, 12:07 AM

nah, def, not... we were even laughing at people stretching BEFORE having the muscle "warm"...
and i specifically stated, in between sets and after

GBAGH · 04-16-2007, 12:13 AM

I stretch a little bit before every workout. I haven't ever had any substantial injuries. I think that the key is to not overdo anything. If you take anything to extremes you could end up hurt pretty bad. I guess that I just considered stretching part of warming up. I don't do the fascia stretching before working out, but I always do some light stretching to make sure that everything is in working order before I put my muscles against the weights.

Number69 · 04-16-2007, 08:06 AM

Out of interest, from our point of view, what is the harm in extra trauma and tering on the muscle seen as we effectively utilise this high intensity method and short workouts with lots of food to grow???

Callavaro · 04-16-2007, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prolangtum

everyone is entitled to their opinion. Maybe there is some science to what he has to say......but results are results....and for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work.

dakota1981 · 04-17-2007, 09:00 PM

Everyone has an opinion. And he, in my opinion, is wrong.

**homonunculus** · 04-17-2007, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prolangtum

scientifiically proven, no....anedoctally yes. Whenever I train DC style I notice hypertrophy in certain areas where I feel the "stretch" when doing the weighted stretches. Quads, chest, and biceps particularly. I know im not alone in this area.

I'm not going to say that I disagree with you, but I feel like playing the Devil's advocate...

Neither scientific studies nor anecdotal evidence proves anything. Proofs (meaning an absolute truth - something that is always true) are done mathematics. (This is a pet peeve - all of the language saying "clinically proven" is egregiously incorrect, IMO.)

It would make sense that a hypertrophying area would be most felt during the stretch. This does not necessarily mean that the stretch is causing the hypertrophy... (Again, I'm just being an asshole here... LOL)

Quote:

Originally Posted by tadams

There are a bunch of studies that have come out recently that have said static stretching a muscle group immediately before weightlifting can increase the risk of injury, i guess he could be referring to one of these. I even saw an article written by Charles Poliquin that said the same thing. The problem with a lot of these studies is that they have conflicting results. Lets not forget about all the studies that talk about protein consumption and how almost every one says high protein diets are useless and you can only take in something like .8g/ lb bodyweight.

Please, post some links or somethin', man. An abstract, a URL, a quote - somethin'...

Quote:

Originally Posted by tadams

Lets not forget about all the studies that talk about protein consumption and how almost every one says high protein diets are useless and you can only take in something like .8g/ lb bodyweight.

If you read the literature (e.g. Peter Lemon or Mark Tarnopolsky's work), you'll see that the scientists are not saying this...

(Ahhh, I feel better now... LOL)

-R

04-15-2007, 12:57 AM	#1
rubinsteinnyc Light-heavyweight Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: NYC- L.E.S. Posts: 1,499	the truth about stretching... ...I am getting certified as a personal trainer at ECITS organization. One of the guys that is teaching the class is a highly acclaimed personal trainer got certificates from ACSM and others... today, he was talking about static stretching... and he stated THAT it is dangerous EVEN in between sets... claims that it only adds to the trauma of the worked muscle, tearing it up... i was stunned and speechless... i told him how it adds to the fullness of the muscle, and helps recovery and all... he was just shaking his head... do not flame me, it's just an opinion of a guy who trains the navy, pro football, basketball, baseball teams... comp. fitness figure women any comments? __________________ -everything happens for a reason NEMO, NEMO ME IMPUNE LACESSIT... "I'm always misunderstanding shit. It reminds me of the time this girl at the gym asked me if I'd train her.... I thought DAMN HELL YEAH! Told her "Let me call some of my buddies and we'll set it up" -SuperD

04-15-2007, 01:09 AM	#2
boondocksmuscle Super-heavyweight Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: in the squat rack Posts: 4,716	some ppl just dont believe in it...i didnt at first...but after i actually tried it consistently i really like it...but if someone is uneducated then they might take it to far and injure themselves...but that can happen with anything...just my opinion __________________ Trey Potter CSCS To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Remember, if you can’t pick it, grow it, or kill it, you shouldn’t be eating it.- Justin Harris Bodybuilding is stressful. The joy is seeing how incredibly the body adapts. The smart thing is to keep the machine as healthy as possible along the way, IMO.- Homon[/FONT]

04-15-2007, 01:13 AM	#3
mhschiefs97 Middleweight Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 636	He was completely against all stretching? I am not big on stretching a body part until it is already finished being worked out and that works awesome for me. I do agree with him that you are just adding to the trauma by stretching a body part in the middle of working it out. There are exceptions though. That is just my opinion though. __________________ I don't like my username so just call me Chris lol. "The only way to find the limits of the possible is by going beyond them to the impossible." To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. DISCOUNT CODE- CGD555 "If people were 1/10th as worried about the rest of their meals as they were about the post workout shake, there would be a hell of a lot more people looking like bodybuilders. " -Trop

04-15-2007, 10:19 AM	#7
homonunculus Super Moderator/Roundtable Expert Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 16,306	Pretty simple - just provide some scientific references and/or evidence (before and after pictures for instance) for these statements: "static stretching... and he stated THAT it is dangerous EVEN in between sets..." "for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work." -R __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a pristine, well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, used up, worn out, and shouting, "Holy #$&^%$^... What a ride!!!" To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 2012 NPC Master's Nationals HW 5th. Mid-USA HW & Overall 2010 NPC Jr. USA HW 4th, Pacific USA Heavy 2nd 2009 NPC Mr. Arizona HW & Overall, Jr. Nationals HW 16th, Smoked at USA's

04-15-2007, 10:37 AM	#8
horsepower Light-heavyweight Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 1,202	Perhaps he was referring to an already injured muscle --I can imagine how excessive static stretching could exacerbate a problem. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. ...where I log my attempt to obtain a medical waiver, get fit, get strong, and enter the armed forces.

04-15-2007, 02:09 AM	#4
prolangtum Light-heavyweight Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 786	everyone is entitled to their opinion. Maybe there is some science to what he has to say......but results are results....and for bodybuilders, weighted fascia stretching has proven to work.

04-15-2007, 05:28 AM	#5
Phil1369 New Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 78	Why have all the osteopaths and chiropractors I've dealt with recommended it ? They all warn against stretching a cold muscle.

04-15-2007, 09:39 AM	#6
Cerberus New Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 18	Context, context, context. To completely statisfy a good argument, we need more substance to work with. Generalizations are killers. i.e. stretching a cold muscle. (btw, is actually a good method of stretching if applied correctly)

04-15-2007, 12:17 PM	#10
Luci Guest Posts: n/a	i can feel the stretch in my chest, lats, bis and quads the most but have big difficulties in stretching other body parts and notice a faster growth in the "better stretched" body parts

04-15-2007, 12:27 PM	#11
tadams Middleweight Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: massachusetts- go sox Posts: 576	There are a bunch of studies that have come out recently that have said static stretching a muscle group immediately before weightlifting can increase the risk of injury, i guess he could be referring to one of these. I even saw an article written by Charles Poliquin that said the same thing. The problem with a lot of these studies is that they have conflicting results. Lets not forget about all the studies that talk about protein consumption and how almost every one says high protein diets are useless and you can only take in something like .8g/ lb bodyweight. __________________ Best Supplements on the Web: To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Discount Code: THA222 "By the end I'm gonna be the only one standing"

04-15-2007, 10:14 PM	#13
rubinsteinnyc Light-heavyweight Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: NYC- L.E.S. Posts: 1,499	actually, i asked HIM and other guy who is there for re-cert. (competitive PL and BBer) and i asked him " do you tell your clients to stretch the bodypart they were workin on after they are done?" he said "NO"... -homonunculus- ill ask him for the scientific data on which he bases his statement. __________________ -everything happens for a reason NEMO, NEMO ME IMPUNE LACESSIT... "I'm always misunderstanding shit. It reminds me of the time this girl at the gym asked me if I'd train her.... I thought DAMN HELL YEAH! Told her "Let me call some of my buddies and we'll set it up" -SuperD

04-15-2007, 10:42 PM	#14
bhman6 Roundtable Expert Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Stow, OH Posts: 6,791	maybe he was referring to stretching heavily BEFORE a workout or game, which has been shown to reduce work output __________________ CEO of Morphogen Nutrition MorphogenNutrition.com 2012 NPC Natural Ohio 2010 NGA Pro Universe 2010 NPC Monster Mash 2010 ONBF Natural Fall Classic 2010 NPC Natural Pennsylvania 2010 NPC Natural Northern USA 2010 INBF Cardinal Classic 2008 NPC Natural Northern USA 2008 NPC Ohio State 2004 NPC Natural Northern USA

04-16-2007, 12:07 AM	#15
rubinsteinnyc Light-heavyweight Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: NYC- L.E.S. Posts: 1,499	nah, def, not... we were even laughing at people stretching BEFORE having the muscle "warm"... and i specifically stated, in between sets and after __________________ -everything happens for a reason NEMO, NEMO ME IMPUNE LACESSIT... "I'm always misunderstanding shit. It reminds me of the time this girl at the gym asked me if I'd train her.... I thought DAMN HELL YEAH! Told her "Let me call some of my buddies and we'll set it up" -SuperD

04-16-2007, 12:13 AM	#16
GBAGH Lightweight Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: New Jersey. Home of nothing good LMAO. Posts: 426	I stretch a little bit before every workout. I haven't ever had any substantial injuries. I think that the key is to not overdo anything. If you take anything to extremes you could end up hurt pretty bad. I guess that I just considered stretching part of warming up. I don't do the fascia stretching before working out, but I always do some light stretching to make sure that everything is in working order before I put my muscles against the weights. __________________ Pain is the fuel that fans the flames of my pyre. A battleplan is only as good as the general carrying it out on the field. This is my war son, and I have the biggest bombs and the smallest conscience.

04-16-2007, 08:06 AM	#17
Number69 New Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 81	Out of interest, from our point of view, what is the harm in extra trauma and tering on the muscle seen as we effectively utilise this high intensity method and short workouts with lots of food to grow???

04-17-2007, 09:00 PM	#19
dakota1981 Bantamweight Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 213	Everyone has an opinion. And he, in my opinion, is wrong.

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