Carbs on non training days?

[TheManGuy]

I know we're not supposed to talk diet, but I need some help.

I'm thinking of going low carb 100g or so on non workout days, while bulking to stay lean.

I do well on low carb diets, but I'll eat as much carbs as I want on training days till 6.

Then on non-workout days I'll cut all carbs, exept veggies, 1 fruit and trace carbs in nuts etc. I'll also do cardio on these day's. 3 days a week.

My body needs the carbs on workout days, but doesn't seem to know what do do with them on non traing day's so I just get fat from them.


I'll still keep my cals high, on off days.


Doing something like this: I'll up the cals as I go along offcourse. With 450-500g pro ed.

Traing day 5000-6000 cals
non traing 4500 cals.

I am trying someting simelair but with lower calories for a cut, and I am losing fat and I'm picking up quite a bit of muscle too.

Any reason why this would be a bad idea? :showoff:

[Egill]

I am trying someting simelair but with lower calories for a cut, and I am losing fat and I'm picking up quite a bit of muscle too.

you're loosing fat and still gaining some muscle,....... seems like it's working to me.

[USMuscle9403]

The only difference with on-day and off-day carbs for me is post workout carbs. I still take them in at the other times I normally would (first thing in the morning since I'm cutting).

[TheManGuy]

So I don't NEED to eat alot of carbs aslong as I'm getting in the calories and beating the logbook?

On workout day's I'll eat probly 400-500g carbs. about 300 of these around my workout. (pre- post workout)

[TheManGuy]

My dietician is very good btw, top level fitness compeditor and does the pre contest diet's of many of the top bb's in my country.

[jimpaul]

So I don't NEED to eat alot of carbs aslong as I'm getting in the calories and beating the logbook?

On workout day's I'll eat probly 400-500g carbs. about 300 of these around my workout. (pre- post workout)

We don't count calories on this program, just protein grams.
As far as what you should eat for carbs, that's pretty individualistic. You'll have to determine how much carbs to eat, depending if your gaining too much fat or to little muscle.

good luck
jim

[TheManGuy]

that's just a ballpark calorie figure. I just eat as much as I can usually.

Thanx. so it seems I'm doing good then.

[Trulyhuge]

I like a lot of carbs the day before leg day...gives me more fuel IMO!

TH

[ski]

I think some complex carbs are necessary on off days, so you can "fuel -up" for the coming training session the next day,I just wouldn`t go overboard on them.

[Massive G]

Even though you don't work out every day of the week your body still has nutritional requirements every day of the week.Those off days from the gym your body is repairing and rebuilding the muscle tissue that you broke down with your workouts and going so low in carbs those days you're not going to have the same recovery as you would just intaking a moderate amount.

[TheManGuy]

If you don't need carbs for energy, then what are their purpouse on my off days?

My body easely uses fat as fuel. He're how I see it.

I need carbs for the insulin spike after a workout to help with nutrient uptake, I also need them on workout days to fuel my workouts and fill my glycogen stores.


So let's say day one is a workout day. I eat as much carbs as I want until about 3.(complex mostly)

then I drink my pre workout shake 45min before workout. then I train at 4, till 5. including 20 min cardio after training(incline treadmill)

At 5 I drink a HUGE post workout shake, then an hour later I eat a HUGE plate of food say 200g cabs here.

Now at this time my glycogen stures should be fully replenished and I've used the postworkout window to it's max.

So the next day I'll live my life, do say 1 hour of walking as my cardio and eat lots of protein and unsaturated fats. Since my body uses both ingested and stored fat as fuel, why would I want to eat carbs on this day??

Don't get me wrong I used to just pile down the food every day. Sure I put on alot of weight, put on about 18lbs of muscle in the last 6 months but also went from 6% bf to 14 %.


I'm sure I can stay lean next time and I'm trying to find the pefect balance for me to acieve maximum muscle gains while staying below 10%bf.


I think that cutting out carbs on off days is the answer for me.

I could eat 300g carbs on off days, but what good will that really do me??



I'm on 160g carbs on workout days at the mo and about 100g on off days and my strength is fine, I squatted 400lbs yesterday night. I'm actually getting stronger and bigger at a good pace while leaning out quite a bit.

Well that's that, thanx everyone for your help and patience.

I'm hoping dante can help me out on this one.

[IronReload 04]

If you don't need carbs for energy, then what are their purpouse on my off days?

My body easely uses fat as fuel. He're how I see it.

I need carbs for the insulin spike after a workout to help with nutrient uptake, I also need them on workout days to fuel my workouts and fill my glycogen stores.


So let's say day one is a workout day. I eat as much carbs as I want until about 3.(complex mostly)

then I drink my pre workout shake 45min before workout. then I train at 4, till 5. including 20 min cardio after training(incline treadmill)

At 5 I drink a HUGE post workout shake, then an hour later I eat a HUGE plate of food say 200g cabs here.

Now at this time my glycogen stures should be fully replenished and I've used the postworkout window to it's max.

So the next day I'll live my life, do say 1 hour of walking as my cardio and eat lots of protein and unsaturated fats. Since my body uses both ingested and stored fat as fuel, why would I want to eat carbs on this day??

Don't get me wrong I used to just pile down the food every day. Sure I put on alot of weight, put on about 18lbs of muscle in the last 6 months but also went from 6% bf to 14 %.


I'm sure I can stay lean next time and I'm trying to find the pefect balance for me to acieve maximum muscle gains while staying below 10%bf.


I think that cutting out carbs on off days is the answer for me.

I could eat 300g carbs on off days, but what good will that really do me??



I'm on 160g carbs on workout days at the mo and about 100g on off days and my strength is fine, I squatted 400lbs yesterday night. I'm actually getting stronger and bigger at a good pace while leaning out quite a bit.

Well that's that, thanx everyone for your help and patience.

I'm hoping dante can help me out on this one.

bump, was wondering the same thing

[lionel]

Themanguy: This is my take on your scenario. First, carbs serve other purposes besides refilling muscle, liver stores etc. Your're assuming that since you have already refilled(whether its maxed out or not, we won't know) glycogen stores with your large pwo shake and large pwo meal, that you won't need any carbs any more cos additional will be stored as fat aye?

I think yo're missing the point about recuperation on off days. These days are much more important than your trainings as they allow your muscles to recover , grow etc. To be able to do this efficiently and to prep yourself for the next similar workout in 3-4 days and to help you beat your log book, your muscles, those that have been put under stress and have glycogen depleted bla bla, need ample, if not more than enought nutrients to be able to recover.

Thus, the 1 of the most anabolic hormones in the body able to achieve this is insulin. And one of the main 'stimulants' of insulin release are carbs. Insulin drives a.a from protein and carbs into glycogen storage that effeciently that abstaining from carbs on non-workout days would hamper growth. Insulin also spares muscle protein.

Also, did you know by consuming meals without carbs, insulin would still increase as increased a.a concentration does cause an insulin release. This means that cells would be primed for glucose absorption in response to insulin release. This means that since no carbs were ingested, blood glucose is taken in and stored. This causes hypoglycemia and to prevent this from happening, liver glycogen is changed to glucose to restore baseline blood glucose levels. All this would lead to nowhere as you're breaking down your own stores, to replenish stores elsewhere.. no net increase joe.

About gaining fat so easily on a bulk.. think the best way to clarify all these and have you gaining lean mass like a monster is by you hiring dante. Best decision..

[TheManGuy]

Make no mistake if I lived in the USA, I would be working with dante. However at my current level and age it simply wont be possible to do so.

So what would be optimal. Remember I'm still gaining muscle here on a low carb diet as we speak.

I understand that insulin is very anabolic, however I simply found that if I eat carbs/suger I get fatter, where as If I eat fat I don't.


Let's say I cheat, eating kfc would be fine, but eating a candy bar is a no-no.


I could eat carbs at breakfast on non-workout days and maybe one more meal at say 2pm.

Eating say 150g of carbs would be OK, but eating 400+grams and then not traing that same day just seems to make me fat!

It's not the calories either, it's the carbs. Would the loss of a couple of insulin spikes(helping recovery but blunting insulin sensitvety) be such a bad thing??

Since my body would then be primed for the carbs on my workout days and I'd get more of a spike post workout.

I'd really like some more opinions since, carbs on off days don't seem to change my recovery ability of up my streangth in the gym either.

[tybolltt]

Carbs help shuttle protein to your muscles, if you don't eat carbs or a moderate amount of fat then your body will/does use protein intake for energy. Keep in mind that Dantes diets are efficient, when you ef with it you are no longer efficient. If your adhere to your carb cutoff, and cardio you will never have a problem.

My advise would be to stick to one goal at a time. It is much harder to gain weight then it is to lose it ask anyone. What I'm doing is getting to my weight goal, then I'll screw with my macro ratios to keep the weight but change composition.