I'm finally starting to take progress pics....

5spotbullseye · 12-06-2007, 08:37 AM

I posted this over in the Dogg Pound because I had questions related to my progress, but I figured that it would be more appropriate here.

After 10+ years of training, it never really dawned on me to take progess pics. Here's my first set.

Here's a few stats:

- 28 years old
- 6'-1" height
- 100% natural.....most "hardcore" supplement ever taken was 2 months worth of creatine monohydrate. Yes, I know creatine isn't "hardcore"!
- graduated high school around 175 lbs
- starting lifting upon graduation
- started DC training around early 2005
- never competed, but recently have considered entering a local natural show if I can figure out the conditioning portion.

As I stated in my other thread, I plan on shedding some bodyfat sometime in the near future (February or March). I've got a pretty good idea of how to do this, but the one thing I worry about is losing muscle in the process. I plan on sticking with a strict carb-cutoff in the evenings, and doing low intensity cardio 2-3 times a week. Hopefully this will trim off the excess fat slowly and retain the muscle.

All comments & advice are welcome. While you're at it, based on experience, what bodyfat % do you think I'm currently at?

I'm around 265 in these photos.

5spotbullseye · 12-06-2007, 08:37 AM

more pics....

wakejump4me · 12-06-2007, 01:44 PM

you don't have too much BF on you , for being in off season . i wouldn't go any further though . shedding BF is not that difficult . start introducing carb cut offs , add some more cardio in there and watch how much progress you are making . if you get to a point where you have trouble with getting lower in BF , but still being able to blast , then go ahead and add more cardio and /or adjust your diet .

it is hard to tell what BF you are.......

wake

**Trulyhuge** · 12-06-2007, 02:02 PM

As stated, not too much bf% at all for offseason. shedding weight (for me) is 10 times easier than gaining quality mass.

5spotbullseye · 12-06-2007, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trulyhuge

As stated, not too much bf% at all for offseason. shedding weight (for me) is 10 times easier than gaining quality mass.

Several guys said the same thing.....but what I'm trying to get at is how long should I plan for when shedding this fat? I've never done it.....I'm not sure how long it takes or at what rate it comes off for me. I'm going to set a carb cutoff at 6pm and start low intensity cardio 2-3 times a week right now. (Schwinn Airdyne bike)

My gut feeling is that it would take 15-20 weeks to really peel off the majority of this fat. If I start to lose too much too quickly, I'll back off the cardio.

5spotbullseye · 12-06-2007, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakejump4me

you don't have too much BF on you , for being in off season . i wouldn't go any further though . shedding BF is not that difficult . start introducing carb cut offs , add some more cardio in there and watch how much progress you are making . if you get to a point where you have trouble with getting lower in BF , but still being able to blast , then go ahead and add more cardio and /or adjust your diet .

it is hard to tell what BF you are.......

wake

That's exactly what I was thinking. I just didn't have any idea of the time frame involved though. I'd hate to judge my progress on too short of a time period, make changes, and do more harm than good. What do you think.....every 2 or 3 weeks use the mirror as the judgement? Should I even worry about the scale?

wakejump4me · 12-07-2007, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5spotbullseye

That's exactly what I was thinking. I just didn't have any idea of the time frame involved though. I'd hate to judge my progress on too short of a time period, make changes, and do more harm than good. What do you think.....every 2 or 3 weeks use the mirror as the judgement? Should I even worry about the scale?

i would not worry about the scale unless you are not seeing any progress in the mirror . don't be like one of those guys that avoid looking in the mirror for 2 weeks or don't turn the light off before you go in the bathroom . check the mirror ever day . it doesn't hurt to step on the scale once/week . check your dry morning weight , and try to do so always at thew same time .

you said you want to start with 2 to 3 times cardio during the week . you don't do any cardio right now ? if you are already doing 2-3 times then i'd go ahead and make 5 sessions out of it . as i said above , if your blasts are still going nice and easy with 5 sessions cardio then i don't think that it would be too much cardio . you might be able to add in more. but i wouldn't do to much in the beginning . you need to find a balance with cardio and diet . you need to find the point, where you know how low you can go in macros and also where your limit is with cardio . when you are aware of this then things will be easy for you .

wake

5spotbullseye · 12-07-2007, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakejump4me

i would not worry about the scale unless you are not seeing any progress in the mirror . don't be like one of those guys that avoid looking in the mirror for 2 weeks or don't turn the light off before you go in the bathroom . check the mirror ever day . it doesn't hurt to step on the scale once/week . check your dry morning weight , and try to do so always at thew same time .

you said you want to start with 2 to 3 times cardio during the week . you don't do any cardio right now ? if you are already doing 2-3 times then i'd go ahead and make 5 sessions out of it . as i said above , if your blasts are still going nice and easy with 5 sessions cardio then i don't think that it would be too much cardio . you might be able to add in more. but i wouldn't do to much in the beginning . you need to find a balance with cardio and diet . you need to find the point, where you know how low you can go in macros and also where your limit is with cardio . when you are aware of this then things will be easy for you .

wake

No, I don't do any cardio. Yeah, I should've done a minimal amount at least, but like I said, I've been able to stay fairly lean all my life without it.....even at 270 lbs.

**HELLA SWOLE** · 12-08-2007, 12:30 AM

Man, you are really holding some good mass and thickness for a natural guy at your height. I am impressed. What are your lifts looking like (poundage wise).

I would say yes, a minimum of 15 weeks would probably be needed to strip the fat off, and maybe closer to 18-20 weeks to get stage-ready-peeled. You could do it though and look GREAT IMO.

My advice would be this when ti comes to dieting:
Account for everything you are eating now and see what kind of eating habits you have ona day-to-day basis. Start out by just 'cleaning" up your foods and eating a similar volume of food...jsut in clean foods though such as:
ANY LEAN meat
egwhites
protein powder
eggs
natural peanut butter
nuts
olive oil
oatmeal
sweet potatoes
brown rice

you know, the usual clean BB'ing foods. After you have "cleaned up your food choices, take into account the amount of carbs, proteins, fats you are taking in on a daily basis. Once you have done this, drop about 50-100g of carbs out of your normal diet, keep fats and proteins the same, and start doing a little cardio (30 min. 3X/wk will work to begin). Pay attention to your conditioning and bodyweight as weel to an extent. Once your progress has plateued, then either increase your cardio by another 1.5-2hrs/wk or drop another 50-100g of carbs out of your diet. Have a refeed every 7-10 days once you have really started making some good progress and you are flattening out and continue the cycle until you get peeled. That is it in simple, general terms.

5Six · 12-14-2007, 12:48 PM

Great size on you bro. Keep it up!

bugmenot · 12-17-2007, 03:34 PM

Edited due to inappropriate nature of post as well as sexual solicitation of members...

ScottMcDonough · 12-17-2007, 03:43 PM

bugmenot, I don't know if this is the site for you.

**HELLA SWOLE** · 12-17-2007, 05:34 PM

I think you may be right Scott. I gave him a 10 day vacation to ponder that exact thought to himself. If he decides to act more appropriately upon his return, he will be allowed to stay. Otherwise...gone for good.

rowdyhouston · 12-18-2007, 12:31 PM

Did I miss something here? Man...I was just excited to see one of the ppl I know on this site..and because I look up to this guy a lot.......???

ScottMcDonough · 12-18-2007, 01:58 PM

rowdy I pmed you. This has the making of a good thread so hopefully it'll get back on track and not generate any more attention than needed for "that guy". OP I'll be looking forward to your progress.

5spotbullseye · 12-19-2007, 08:23 AM

lol - what did I miss with this bugmenot guy?

I haven't checked this thread in awhile.....thanks for the replies so far guys

Rowdy - nice to hear from ya.....It sounds like I'll be seeing ya from time to time over Christmas.

Swole - thats actually very close to what I originally had planned on doing. I'm sure I'll be tweaking it as I go, but I'm sure once I start seeing results It'll get interesting.

I've been doing my cardio for about 2.5 weeks now and it seems to be going well. I've reduced my carb intake overall, especially on my non-workout days. I'll soon be trying out TrueProtein's BCAA Boost prior to cardio sessions in the morning....this will hopefully jumpstart my metabolism even more.

I need some opinions on something that I've tried recently. Right after a workout, I've been using 40-80g of Waxy maize and 10g of PeptoPro, 15 minutes later, I used to eat a solid meal. Recently I've replaced that with a liquid meal - 40g whey, 1 cup of milk, 2 bananas - and I've noticed a big difference in the ease of digestion. I've even used this on occasion for breakfast. What do you guys think of this?

MilitaryMuscle · 12-19-2007, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5spotbullseye

I need some opinions on something that I've tried recently. Right after a workout, I've been using 40-80g of Waxy maize and 10g of PeptoPro, 15 minutes later, I used to eat a solid meal. Recently I've replaced that with a liquid meal - 40g whey, 1 cup of milk, 2 bananas - and I've noticed a big difference in the ease of digestion. I've even used this on occasion for breakfast. What do you guys think of this?

thats hwat i do... 120 g WMS with 25 bcaa's then i follow it up 20-30 minutes later with whey and cereal..... i love kids cereal! Might wana ditch that milk though.....

5spotbullseye · 12-19-2007, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilitaryMuscle

thats hwat i do... 120 g WMS with 25 bcaa's then i follow it up 20-30 minutes later with whey and cereal..... i love kids cereal! Might wana ditch that milk though.....

Milk - maybe I'm not real in-tune with my body, but I've never noticed any setbacks with milk. I don't get bloated from it at all, and I don't seem to have any digestion problems with it either. I actually stopped drinking milk for 3 or 4 weeks awhile ago.....just to see what would happen.....nothing. I dunno. Although, I can definately see where it would slow down the protein absorbtion, which isn't ideal in either of these cases. Maybe on that reason alone I should ditch it.

5spotbullseye · 12-19-2007, 11:49 AM

Here's currently what I've been eating (for the most part):

WORKOUT DAY

Breakfast (5am)
1 serving (??g) of Trueprotein's BCAA Boost
(wait 15 minutes)
Shake - 40g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas
3g Fish Oil
Multivitamin
1 teaspoon Psyllium husks

Mid-Morning (9am)
8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (30g or less) complex carbs

Lunch (1pm)
8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (20g or less) complex carbs

Pre-Workout (4:30pm)
40g whey concentrate
1 large banana

Post-Workout (7pm)
10g PeptoPro, 80g Waxy Maize
(wait 15 minutes)
Shake - 50g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas

Bedtime (9:30pm)
50g whey concentrate
3g Fish Oil
1 tablespoon of natural PB
1 teaspoon Psyllium husks

OFF-DAY / CARDIO DAY

Breakfast (5am)
1 serving (??g) of Trueprotein's BCAA Boost
CARDIO; 30 min low intensity (Schwinn Airdyne bike)
Shake - 40g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas
3g Fish Oil
Multivitamin
1 teaspoon Psyllium husks

Mid-Morning (9am)
8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (30g or less) complex carbs

Lunch (1pm)
8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (20g or less) complex carbs

Supper (5:30pm)
8 oz meat, mixed veggies, limited complex carbs

Evening Snack (if needed)
Raw spinach w/ oil dressing

Bedtime (9:30pm)
50g whey concentrate
3g Fish Oil
1 tablespoon of natural PB
1 teaspoon Psyllium husks

Here's a few questions:

- I hear various opinions on fruit while cutting......what's the deal?

- I realize that "low carb" means something different for everybody. Myself, when I'm bulking, I eat upwards of 500-600g of carbs per day. Plus, without doing cardio at all, my body composition isn't real bad (see original pics). Having said that, when I attempt to go "low carb", what kind of daily intake do you think I should aiming for?

- Am I hurting myself by consuming a liquid shake for breakfast and my post workout meal? The macros are there and the digestion is SO much more comfortable. Any harm to this?

- This has been mentioned before.....milk......how critical is the absence of it? If I use a little bit (1 cup or less) in my breakfast and post workout shake, will it hurt anything?

bubbachew · 12-22-2007, 02:42 PM

Lookin' big, 5spot....what competition would you think about entering? I don't live far from Meyersdale and was always wondering if there were any near?

Richard85 · 01-04-2008, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trulyhuge

As stated, not too much bf% at all for offseason. shedding weight (for me) is 10 times easier than gaining quality mass.

I second that... if my bf gets out of hand i can lose what fat i have in two or three weeks... its adding muscle mass that is tricky

5spotbullseye · 01-09-2008, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bubbachew

Lookin' big, 5spot....what competition would you think about entering? I don't live far from Meyersdale and was always wondering if there were any near?

I have no idea. I'm not even sure if I'm competition material yet. The conditioning part is the tricky part when dealing with natural bb's....I'm waiting to see if I can figure that part out first. By the way, where do you live?

5spotbullseye · 01-09-2008, 11:11 AM

Well, here's a quick update on my progress.

As shown above, my cut began during the early part of December, where I weighed around 270 lbs. About a week into the cardio and revamped diet plan, I took some photos where I weighed around 265 lbs. (water weight entirely)

Currently I weigh around 255 lbs and things are starting to tighten up a bit. The strength level is still ok (I'm still making gains in poundages) and the cardio has been about 4 times per week.

I should've waited until January to start this cut since Christmas and New Year's was in there. I'm holding off on pictures until I get a nice clean month under my belt. I was fairly good on the diet for all of December, but I cheated more than I would've liked around the holidays.

The first few weeks I was using the traditional low intensity, longer duration cardio. However, after some serious debate, I've switched it over to HIIT cardio. I feel 100% better with this method. I GUARANTEE YOU that my metabolism is elevated much higher throughout the day...resulting in a more efficient fat loss. Here's a rundown.....Schwinn Airdyne stationary bike....4 days a week (off days)....BCAA's & WMS prior to cardio session, whey, egg whites, and some fruit afterwards..... 5 minute warmup, 10 minute HIIT session.....10 sec sprint, 50 sec moderate pace, repeat 10 times. The fat seems to be melting off right now.

Overall, things are starting to look really good, in my opinion. I will post up some pics when I get further along (few weeks maybe).

5spotbullseye · 01-10-2008, 08:28 AM

Here's a quick shot I took before New Year's.....which is almost 2 weeks ago.

I've managed to clean up the diet since the holidays are over. What do you guys think?

12-06-2007, 01:44 PM	#3
wakejump4me The Specialist Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4,308	you don't have too much BF on you , for being in off season . i wouldn't go any further though . shedding BF is not that difficult . start introducing carb cut offs , add some more cardio in there and watch how much progress you are making . if you get to a point where you have trouble with getting lower in BF , but still being able to blast , then go ahead and add more cardio and /or adjust your diet . it is hard to tell what BF you are....... wake __________________ to save as much money as possible on all your orders from www.TrueProtein.com type AXW999 in the discountcode box Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect. Vince Lombardi

12-08-2007, 12:30 AM	#9
HELLA SWOLE Moderator Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 938	Man, you are really holding some good mass and thickness for a natural guy at your height. I am impressed. What are your lifts looking like (poundage wise). I would say yes, a minimum of 15 weeks would probably be needed to strip the fat off, and maybe closer to 18-20 weeks to get stage-ready-peeled. You could do it though and look GREAT IMO. My advice would be this when ti comes to dieting: Account for everything you are eating now and see what kind of eating habits you have ona day-to-day basis. Start out by just 'cleaning" up your foods and eating a similar volume of food...jsut in clean foods though such as: ANY LEAN meat egwhites protein powder eggs natural peanut butter nuts olive oil oatmeal sweet potatoes brown rice you know, the usual clean BB'ing foods. After you have "cleaned up your food choices, take into account the amount of carbs, proteins, fats you are taking in on a daily basis. Once you have done this, drop about 50-100g of carbs out of your normal diet, keep fats and proteins the same, and start doing a little cardio (30 min. 3X/wk will work to begin). Pay attention to your conditioning and bodyweight as weel to an extent. Once your progress has plateued, then either increase your cardio by another 1.5-2hrs/wk or drop another 50-100g of carbs out of your diet. Have a refeed every 7-10 days once you have really started making some good progress and you are flattening out and continue the cycle until you get peeled. That is it in simple, general terms. __________________ I get my protein and supplements at www.trueprotein.com For a 5% discount, use the code "SPD365"

12-17-2007, 03:34 PM	#11
bugmenot New Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: New York Posts: 9	Edited due to inappropriate nature of post as well as sexual solicitation of members... Last edited by HELLA SWOLE : 12-17-2007 at 05:37 PM.

12-17-2007, 05:34 PM	#13
HELLA SWOLE Moderator Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 938	I think you may be right Scott. I gave him a 10 day vacation to ponder that exact thought to himself. If he decides to act more appropriately upon his return, he will be allowed to stay. Otherwise...gone for good. __________________ I get my protein and supplements at www.trueprotein.com For a 5% discount, use the code "SPD365"

12-19-2007, 08:23 AM	#16
5spotbullseye Bantamweight Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Meyersdale, PA Posts: 160	lol - what did I miss with this bugmenot guy? I haven't checked this thread in awhile.....thanks for the replies so far guys Rowdy - nice to hear from ya.....It sounds like I'll be seeing ya from time to time over Christmas. Swole - thats actually very close to what I originally had planned on doing. I'm sure I'll be tweaking it as I go, but I'm sure once I start seeing results It'll get interesting. I've been doing my cardio for about 2.5 weeks now and it seems to be going well. I've reduced my carb intake overall, especially on my non-workout days. I'll soon be trying out TrueProtein's BCAA Boost prior to cardio sessions in the morning....this will hopefully jumpstart my metabolism even more. I need some opinions on something that I've tried recently. Right after a workout, I've been using 40-80g of Waxy maize and 10g of PeptoPro, 15 minutes later, I used to eat a solid meal. Recently I've replaced that with a liquid meal - 40g whey, 1 cup of milk, 2 bananas - and I've noticed a big difference in the ease of digestion. I've even used this on occasion for breakfast. What do you guys think of this? __________________ Andy -lifetime drug free My journal: http://www.intensemuscle.com/32959-a...n-journal.html

12-06-2007, 02:02 PM	#4
Trulyhuge Moderator Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Living at the dinner table Posts: 3,598	As stated, not too much bf% at all for offseason. shedding weight (for me) is 10 times easier than gaining quality mass.

12-14-2007, 12:48 PM	#10
5Six New Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 5	Great size on you bro. Keep it up!

12-17-2007, 03:43 PM	#12
ScottMcDonough Heavyweight Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 2,454	bugmenot, I don't know if this is the site for you.

12-18-2007, 12:31 PM	#14
rowdyhouston New Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 19	Did I miss something here? Man...I was just excited to see one of the ppl I know on this site..and because I look up to this guy a lot.......???

12-18-2007, 01:58 PM	#15
ScottMcDonough Heavyweight Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 2,454	rowdy I pmed you. This has the making of a good thread so hopefully it'll get back on track and not generate any more attention than needed for "that guy". OP I'll be looking forward to your progress.

12-19-2007, 11:49 AM	#19
5spotbullseye Bantamweight Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Meyersdale, PA Posts: 160	Current diet plan..... Here's currently what I've been eating (for the most part): WORKOUT DAY Breakfast (5am) 1 serving (??g) of Trueprotein's BCAA Boost (wait 15 minutes) Shake - 40g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas 3g Fish Oil Multivitamin 1 teaspoon Psyllium husks Mid-Morning (9am) 8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (30g or less) complex carbs Lunch (1pm) 8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (20g or less) complex carbs Pre-Workout (4:30pm) 40g whey concentrate 1 large banana Post-Workout (7pm) 10g PeptoPro, 80g Waxy Maize (wait 15 minutes) Shake - 50g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas Bedtime (9:30pm) 50g whey concentrate 3g Fish Oil 1 tablespoon of natural PB 1 teaspoon Psyllium husks OFF-DAY / CARDIO DAY Breakfast (5am) 1 serving (??g) of Trueprotein's BCAA Boost CARDIO; 30 min low intensity (Schwinn Airdyne bike) Shake - 40g whey concentrate, 1 cup skim milk, 2 bananas 3g Fish Oil Multivitamin 1 teaspoon Psyllium husks Mid-Morning (9am) 8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (30g or less) complex carbs Lunch (1pm) 8 oz meat, mixed veggies, small amount (20g or less) complex carbs Supper (5:30pm) 8 oz meat, mixed veggies, limited complex carbs Evening Snack (if needed) Raw spinach w/ oil dressing Bedtime (9:30pm) 50g whey concentrate 3g Fish Oil 1 tablespoon of natural PB 1 teaspoon Psyllium husks Here's a few questions: - I hear various opinions on fruit while cutting......what's the deal? - I realize that "low carb" means something different for everybody. Myself, when I'm bulking, I eat upwards of 500-600g of carbs per day. Plus, without doing cardio at all, my body composition isn't real bad (see original pics). Having said that, when I attempt to go "low carb", what kind of daily intake do you think I should aiming for? - Am I hurting myself by consuming a liquid shake for breakfast and my post workout meal? The macros are there and the digestion is SO much more comfortable. Any harm to this? - This has been mentioned before.....milk......how critical is the absence of it? If I use a little bit (1 cup or less) in my breakfast and post workout shake, will it hurt anything? __________________ Andy -lifetime drug free My journal: http://www.intensemuscle.com/32959-a...n-journal.html

12-22-2007, 02:42 PM	#20
bubbachew New Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 1	Lookin' big, 5spot....what competition would you think about entering? I don't live far from Meyersdale and was always wondering if there were any near?

01-09-2008, 11:11 AM	#23
5spotbullseye Bantamweight Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Meyersdale, PA Posts: 160	Well, here's a quick update on my progress. As shown above, my cut began during the early part of December, where I weighed around 270 lbs. About a week into the cardio and revamped diet plan, I took some photos where I weighed around 265 lbs. (water weight entirely) Currently I weigh around 255 lbs and things are starting to tighten up a bit. The strength level is still ok (I'm still making gains in poundages) and the cardio has been about 4 times per week. I should've waited until January to start this cut since Christmas and New Year's was in there. I'm holding off on pictures until I get a nice clean month under my belt. I was fairly good on the diet for all of December, but I cheated more than I would've liked around the holidays. The first few weeks I was using the traditional low intensity, longer duration cardio. However, after some serious debate, I've switched it over to HIIT cardio. I feel 100% better with this method. I GUARANTEE YOU that my metabolism is elevated much higher throughout the day...resulting in a more efficient fat loss. Here's a rundown.....Schwinn Airdyne stationary bike....4 days a week (off days)....BCAA's & WMS prior to cardio session, whey, egg whites, and some fruit afterwards..... 5 minute warmup, 10 minute HIIT session.....10 sec sprint, 50 sec moderate pace, repeat 10 times. The fat seems to be melting off right now. Overall, things are starting to look really good, in my opinion. I will post up some pics when I get further along (few weeks maybe). __________________ Andy -lifetime drug free My journal: http://www.intensemuscle.com/32959-a...n-journal.html

01-10-2008, 08:28 AM	#24
5spotbullseye Bantamweight Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Meyersdale, PA Posts: 160	Here's a quick shot I took before New Year's.....which is almost 2 weeks ago. I've managed to clean up the diet since the holidays are over. What do you guys think? __________________ Andy -lifetime drug free My journal: http://www.intensemuscle.com/32959-a...n-journal.html

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